Dash Cluster Change

[firefighter_0029]

I gotta few questions. I changed my dash and chanced the wires around in the connector. Dash works great but i got a problem. I have the 3800 motor and I can't figure out where the oil and temp senders are to make the guages work(I had idiot lights before). I also need to know how to hook up the tach.

[Gearhead43]

Well,

 

It would be helpful to others here if you post a bit more information.

 

Year of car

Make & Model of Car

Year of Engine swapped in

[firefighter_0029]

there was no motor swap??? wtf??? my car is a 1992 regal custom but mine had the idiot lights and the new cluster is also from a 1992 regal custom but it has guages

[jeremy]

there was no motor swap??? wtf???

 

he should have been the one saying "WTF" to you...he is taking the time to try to help you with your half-a$$, shitty written question that contained no information and you snap back a rude a$$ remark....if I were him, I would tell you where to stick your damn cluster....

[digitaloutsider]

he should have been the one saying "WTF" to you...he is taking the time to try to help you with your half-a$$, shitty written question that contained no information and you snap back a rude a$$ remark....if I were him, I would tell you where to stick your damn cluster....

[Guest Anonymous]

[DiscoStudd]

I gotta few questions. I changed my dash and chanced the wires around in the connector. Dash works great but i got a problem. I have the 3800 motor and I can't figure out where the oil and temp senders are to make the guages work(I had idiot lights before). I also need to know how to hook up the tach.

 

The temp sensor is either mounted in the head or the thermostat housing. Not sure if the 3800 has 1 sensor each for the computer and idiot light, or if it has a combo (3 wire) for both. If you do have 2 sensors, the one with a single green wire is the one for the dash light (the one for the computer has a yellow and a yellow/brown wire.) You will have to change this over to a 2 wire sensor (look for one in the boneyard- find the same car the cluster was from if possible, and get the connector also.) You will have to run a new wire from the 2nd wire on the new sensor to the dash cluster for the temp gauge to work. I would suggest going to the library and looking up the wiring schematics for the dash and the Ignition Module (ICM.)

 

The oil sender is located near the oil filter. No need to run any new wires, just swap the old one out.

 

For the tach, you have to run a wire from the cluster to the ICM. I believe the wire is the WHITE wire second from the top (don't quote me on that, though-- look it up to be sure.) The wire is WHITE, but there's 2 white wires at the ICM...

[firefighter_0029]

do you know where the wire goes to in the cluster? i have the wiring diagram at the icm its the 121 wht tach wire the 5th one in on the icm but i do't have a diagram of the das cluster i have no idea what wire it goes to in the dash cluster there are 2 white wires in the harness if that is where it goes?

[DiscoStudd]

The only way to know for sure is to either buy the factory service manual (check eBay) or go to your local public library and look up the schematic in the (don't quote me, I don't remember the name off hand) Jacobs or Helm manual. I did this when I swapped the cluster from my 85 Grand Am to one from an 89. When you get to the library do a search for "Buick Regal" or "GM W BODY" to find the right book. They're in the reference section and are HUGE, thick books with tons of schematics, etc. Make a copy of the page to take home with you. They don't illustrate the pinouts, they just put a number next to the wire-- you correspond that to your harness (sometimes they're numbered.)

 

I made an Excel spreadsheet back when I did the swap the first time (I went from 85 to 88, then to an 89.) I just found it on my hard drive. I will post it HERE.

It won't be an exact match for your Regal, but the wires are most likely the same color, so you can kind of connect the dots...

 

Good luck, and most of all, have patience! It will work if you take your time.

[firefighter_0029]

Hey, I got everything working but the Temp Guage. According to the book i got the motor is supposed to have 2 temp sensors I think? Well, the schematic in the book tells me that it should have 2 sensors one with a green wire and another with a yellow wire and a black wire it also tells me that the temp/coolant sensor is supposed to be around the alternator somewhere. I tore the ICM and the Alt. off to find nothing, there aren't even any plugs in the head or anything??? One of by buddies looked up in a differant book and said that an old 3.8 instead of the 3800 had the coolant sensor under the throttle neck I looked and thats where it was, but it's the one for the comp the 2 wire yel/blk one. So I went back to the parts store to see what sensor for the temp there are and he said the computer lists 2 one for a guage a 2 wire one (same one as i have under the throttle neck) and then there is one with just one green wire but the comp at the parts store said that was for the idiot light? I also asked if they make a 3 wire sensor so he went in the back and looked at every sensor he had and didn't find any. so I'm pretty much stuck. I was wondering where you found out about the 3 wire sensor and what vehicle that was in?

[Lee]

Hi, I can't say where the correct temp sensor is on a Gen 1 3800...but....on my 3.1 the ECM sensor is under the throttle body just like your's and the one for the dash is just behind the motor on the driver side near the EGR valve.

 

Assuming there isn't a big difference in sensors:

Here's a help. The sensor for the ECM has no wires protruding from it. It looks like an odd spark plug.

The sensor you are looking for has a single green wire atached to it. (like an oxygen sensor has). Call it a pigtail.

 

I don't know of any three wire sensor. The difference between the one in your car now and the one you want is that:

 

The current one sends a (90?) ohm signal when hot and the light comes on in the dash, or 0 ohm signal...no light. Sensor switch.

 

The one you want sends a variable current signal, 0 to 90? Sensor Sender.

 

If you were to just leave the same sensor in there...when the motor got hot enough it would send your temp gage in the dash to max, 90 ohms. Mine is digital and I get a red triangle lit up. I haven't gotten mine changed out yet.

 

Good luck. Oh by the way, quick apoligies for quick thoughts work well with these guys. They're very forgiving and helpfull to those who say sorry.

[DiscoStudd]

Maybe the sensor is on the side of the block somewhere?

 

I heard about the 3 wire sensor over at 60*V6.com. The newer 3400's have a single 3 wire sensor for the ECM and Gauge.

 

When I changed the sensor on my GA, I got the sensor at the boneyard (I don't think it was from the same car even.) I took my old single wire sensor with me and found a GM car with a temp gauge, then took out the sensor to see if it was similar. I then cut off the harness and took it with me.

 

I even tried hooking up the cluster with the old sensor to see if it would peg the needle of the gauge when overheated (I had the sensor out and had a friend hold a lighter up to it.) It didn't work at all. I then put in the 2 wire sensor and wired it wrong. Instead of moving the needle, it made one of the idiot lights fade in and out (it was like the hotter it got, the brighter the light got.) I switched the 2 wires (at the sensor, not the cluster) around and it worked perfectly.

 

Now that I think about it, I still have my factory service manual from my old 92 LeSabre with the 3800. I could go dig that out and find out for sure where the temp sensor is. I'll try to find it and I'll post back tomorrow or Wednesday.

[firefighter_0029]

Lee is right you guys. 10 people pissed me off on the internet at the same time, and then when i got on here the one guy was asking me about a motor swap I lost it. I am sorry you guys I lost my temper. (That chick with the plunger was funny though) thanx for all the info... By the way if anyone else runs into this trouble on the 3800 follow the ICM harness behind the alternator and up to the top of the motor and theres a connector with about 8 wires under the plastic cover that says "3800" in it there will be a white wire going into it but not coming out this is the wire you need for the tach. Hook this wire to the white wire on the front of the harness #C11. Also if you take the coolant bottle and the belt off you can see the oil filter and the oil pressure sensor to make the oil pressure guage work just go to the parts store and ask for the oil pressure sensor for the guage (it's about an inch longer than the idiot light sensor) change it and the oil pressure guage works.

[DiscoStudd]

OK, I scanned in some pics from 4 different manuals. The 92 LeSabre FSM only showed an illustration of where it was (it looks like a bolt.)

Here's the illustration. It is #105 in the pic.

Here's the opposite page explaining what the numbers mean.

 

Here's what the Hayne's manual for the H-Bodies lists.

 

Here's what the Hayne's manual for the W-Bodies lists for the 3800.

 

And finally, here's what the Haynes manual lists for the 98-01 Lumina/Monte/Impala with the 3800.

 

Some conflicting info, that's for sure. I hope maybe I pointed you in the right direction. I'd say that if you couldn't find it, try to find a thermostat housing from a 3800 that has the sensor in it and see if it would fit your car. Then just rewire the cluster to the sensor you mount in the new housing. Lots of luck!