Guest Gp crazy Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 i just got a Grand Prix ste with a 4 speed tranny. why is the speedo 30 miles an hour off ? ie. 80 = 50 & 100 = 65 ? and anything slower is way to slow to go 30 is on the speedo is like 10 mph ? the car came stock with 215-60-16 and that's what's on it now at 80 the tach is around 2500 rpms in od. at 100 or more it's at little over 3000rpms ? any ideas ? :shock: thanks jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redfox340 Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 Well, even though you have the 215/60-R16 tires, the gauge shouldn't be reading ridiculously off. Best guess at the moment would be either the Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS)... Any other details you can give us? - Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 Check the speed sensors on the front wheels...they're probably malfunctioning or are dying/dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robby1870 Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 Check the speed sensors on the front wheels...they're probably malfunctioning or are dying/dead. Well, he cant check those, cuz they dont exist! The VSS is on the passenger half-shaft, and that is what gives the speedo the speed. Sometimes a speedo thats off by that much and has a good VSS, means the ECM is on its way out or is out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkorinko Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 My speedo has been acting up too! And i think the comp is freaking out, i made a post about the check engine lights all flashing so my buddy at Merle's is getting me an entire new computer for free!!! I'll let everyone know if this fixes my problem! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted December 26, 2003 Report Share Posted December 26, 2003 Check the speed sensors on the front wheels...they're probably malfunctioning or are dying/dead. i think you might be referring to the ABS sensors. joshua Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gp crazy Posted December 28, 2003 Report Share Posted December 28, 2003 well today my friend and i hook up my ste to a portable scan tool made by snap on . test drove the car 45 = 35 and 40 = 30 . also any ideas why my ste runs so rich? you can go about 50 miles and burn about 11 dollars in fuel ouch and the trip computer says my avrage speed is only 12 mph after a 50 mile trip at 70 mph any ideas? yes this trip was expensive. i get a code 45 which means running rich yep plugs are black and black smoke is pumping out of the exhaust. on the scan tool it shows running LEAN but this is not true Black out of my ex tips not a good thing to me or my wife. im looking in to maybe a set of bad fuel injectors or regulator? any thoughts about this ? well my ste does have wheel sensors only because it was that wierd ABS SYSTEM which is $$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fix. im going to get a diffrent dash cluster and see if that fixes the problem with the speedo. thanks for all your info 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaPaPooh Posted December 28, 2003 Report Share Posted December 28, 2003 the scan tool can see the o2 sensor sounds like it may be staying in open lood did you see that on the snap on scan tool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quaddriver Posted December 28, 2003 Report Share Posted December 28, 2003 well today my friend and i hook up my ste to a portable scan tool made by snap on . test drove the car 45 = 35 and 40 = 30 . also any ideas why my ste runs so rich? you can go about 50 miles and burn about 11 dollars in fuel ouch and the trip computer says my avrage speed is only 12 mph after a 50 mile trip at 70 mph any ideas? yes this trip was expensive. i get a code 45 which means running rich yep plugs are black and black smoke is pumping out of the exhaust. on the scan tool it shows running LEAN but this is not true Black out of my ex tips not a good thing to me or my wife. im looking in to maybe a set of bad fuel injectors or regulator? any thoughts about this ? well my ste does have wheel sensors only because it was that wierd ABS SYSTEM which is $$$$$$$$$$$$$ to fix. im going to get a diffrent dash cluster and see if that fixes the problem with the speedo. thanks for all your info 8) I dont think I caught the year, but its OBD1, so off the top of my head...while using said scan tool, see what speed it says you are going...while having someone pace you. see if the VSS agrees with the other car - if it does - the speedo head is bad. If not, then the VSS reluctor is bad - replace it. on to running rich - after 110-120* on the temp (also displayed on the scan) it should go from open loop to closed (loop status is also displayed) Once it goes closed (if it does not, check the CTS/ECT (same sensor, it has been renamed since your car was built) - it might need replaced. suffice to say tho, the tranny wont go into lockup until its in closed loop so you can also drive into 3rd/4th (depending on what tranny u have) and watch the TCC command change. ok, once closed, do a few quick tests...check the IAC at idle (60's) vs on the gas (130+) - make sure she is not stuck, check the TPS at idle - .5 optimum, but .39->.7ish allowed, make sure the TPS increases as you slowly give it gas, also make sure throttle angle changes. next goto the O2S reading and look for the mv - should be 400ish to 600ish at idle and the car should swap lean/rich and O2 crosscounts should be going up slowly. If none of these exist - replace the O2s depending on what motor you have you should also like injector pulse width, make sure it varies low to high as you give gas (but this does not mean the injectors are obeying - you could have a broken pintle spring that negates that. perform these tests and get back... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted December 28, 2003 Report Share Posted December 28, 2003 Check the speed sensors on the front wheels...they're probably malfunctioning or are dying/dead. i think you might be referring to the ABS sensors. joshua ah hah! Sorry about that! Yea, that's what I was thinking of. If i remember correctly they have a dual purpose of sending the wheel speed and for ABS type stuff. I'm not some huge gear head or anything, but I remember reading that somewhere when i bought my cutty as being a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gp crazy Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 it's a 1990 3.1 vin t with a 4 speed tranny yep it,s odb1 im running out of options here i did all the test and so far the cpu. is responding to all but intergrater spelling is wrong if you take the o2 sensor and grnd. this thing went down & if you run 1 volt to the o2 sensor it maxed out =175 on the low end you get 76 or lower. the o2 sensor with 1 volt read 1089 mv & grnd. read 0mv. it does go into closed loop & the mv were between 450 and 800 to high? the fuel psi running at idle is 34psi snap th. then it goes to 42 psi then levels off to 28 or so at 2500 rpms. i pinched the return line and got a between 70-85 psi then with the car off, key off psi built up 92 psi ????????? line still pinched and it did not drop off ? what is block learn ? mine is 120 ? also af. ratio is 14.7:1 but never changes. the cat is very warm. i even went as far to tap the block with a hammer & the knock sensor did not pick it up. posiable problem? how about egr it says solenoid 1,2,3 are off should they be off? 8) not spelled right either thank for all of your help jeff i have about 5 days to figure this out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quaddriver Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 it's a 1990 3.1 vin t with a 4 speed tranny yep it,s odb1 Ok let me try and pick these off 1 by 1.... im running out of options here i did all the test and so far the cpu. is responding to all but intergrater Should be in some instances changing - I suspect fried O2 if you take the o2 sensor and grnd. this thing went down & if you run 1 volt to the o2 sensor it maxed out =175 on the low end you get 76 or lower. the o2 sensor with 1 volt read 1089 mv & grnd. read 0mv Im not sure what you mean here, if you applied voltage, even a tiny amount, its fried it does go into closed loop & the mv were between 450 and 800 to high? nah, Im not too excited about that running at idle is 34psi snap th. then it goes to 42 psi then levels off to 28 or so at 2500 rpms. for grins, use a vacuum gauge and see if the regulator holds vacuum what is block learn ? mine is 120 ? also af. ratio is 14.7:1 but never changes Here is a quick tutorial on BLM: http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/faq/BLMINT.html Different beast but the basics are there. 14.7 is stoich. You wont see a change unless you jump on the gas for over 1500rpm for a longer period of time and produce a WOT condition. I do not recommend this while in park. the cat is very warm well it should be. If it gets 'freakishly warm' (technical term ;-) ) as verified by an IR thermo, then Id suspect fuel being burned in the cat i even went as far to tap the block with a hammer & the knock sensor did not pick it up The KS might be bad, but this is a different flea - it will affect timing advance, not idle 'mixture' how about egr it says solenoid 1,2,3 are off should they be off? EGR does not run at idle or WOT. The 3 valve system comes on progressively as you run under load and shuts off when you return the throttle to base. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaPaPooh Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 'freakishly warm' (technical term ;-) ) as verified by an IR thermo, then Id suspect fuel being burned in the cat basicly what he is say with that so called tech term is if it glows red hot you have problem he has to scew the terms to confuse you!!! this is as easy as getting the scan tool again and looking at the o2 and seeing if it goes to closed loop or stays in open loop on thee scan tool thats the first step if you can get your hands on it again do it good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaPaPooh Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 oh and to add to the speedo problem the scan tool can look at your abs system too i would do that also with the scan tool if you can get! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gp crazy Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 im going to reset the cpu and if the scan tool is still here im going to hook it up. im also going to run a vac test on the whole engine then brake it up in sections and take notes 8) thanks' jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaPaPooh Posted December 29, 2003 Report Share Posted December 29, 2003 im going to reset the cpu and if the scan tool is still here im going to hook it up. im also going to run a vac test on the whole engine then brake it up in sections and take notes 8) thanks' jeff good luck man hope you get it running right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gp crazy Posted December 31, 2003 Report Share Posted December 31, 2003 I just Sat here yesterday and went over the whole thing again . i looked at plugs,wires,vac & fuel psi. then i looked at the fuel psi gage and it has a release valve of course so with the car running i let the fuel run out in to a bucket & i got a lot AIR AIR & more AIR it was like this for about 2 mins :?: then i shut it off and reset the cpu and it runs mighty fine now no SES light and way more th. response for a such a heavy car it moves right along mine weighs 3385 lbs. and gets about 26.8 miles to gal highway 8) . the only two major things i have left to fix is the abs unit :dammit: and the speedo so my wife & kids can have a nice lookin safe ride with options to boot. :devil: :devil: im lookin for some snows tires for this ride yep it has to be an all weather ride 215/60/16 right now it has all season that Suck in snow and slush. it has been nice here so far but that will change soon Thanks for all your time and efforts & info this problem has been FIXED jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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