98 GP GT no start no crank only click

[98gpgt]

The click being the relay near the glove box presumably. I had thought the problem was a questionable battery bolt, the damned things always seem to strip on me. But no found a better one snuggled it down, and nuffing. I will point out I can't remove my key w/o depressing that button on the underside of the steering wheel, sort of. But the clicking relay means ignition switch is good, no? I realize I need to test the starter (hammer, test light). But wanted to be sure if the problem is "forward" of the passenger compartment relay.

 

 

I had heard my problem with the key could be a bad wire in the console. Could my no start problem be in there also? Or does the clicking relay prove that it isn't? I'm pulling the console anyway, way overdo for a cleaning.

 

 

Let's say it is the starter - should I go all out and buy a new Bosch? Or would a cheaper variety last me to 200k miles (got ~143k now)?

 

 

 

 

 

 

******Why doesn't this message board register my paragraph breaks?*******

[98gpgt]

And by the way since this is a possible problem, can you really easily disable the pk3 system like this (with a resistor):

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YG7ohbRHaic

 

I don't think that's my problem, but it's good to know.

[Imp558]

PK2, not PK3. PK3 isn't a key resistor it's a transponder. What you're hearing should be the antitheft relay engaging and that means it's not a passkey problem so it's a moot point. Need to check the starter and the neutral safety switch on the tranny. I can post some prints for you tonight and point out some places to test, it's likely a starter though.

[98gpgt]

You're right. I did the 10 minute thing a while ago, no change. Dammed starters act up when it's very cold or very hot/humid. Is it worth it to try and repair the starter? I don't mind buying a new one. But why spend it if you don't have to. New Bosch unit was like 126$ on rock.

[Imp558]

Jump the starter with a screwdriver or something before you condemn it. There's plenty of good used ones in the yard if need be.

[55trucker]

A starter failure is *usually* the contact disc or one of the two large copper contact points inside the solenoid (the large battery bolt being one of the two), as the starter ages from continued use both the disc surface & the contact points wear away & when the deterioration is serious enough you turn the key & *surprise* nothing happens as the solenoid cannot energize (& that has nothing to do with pink bunnies beating a drum).

[rich_e777]

IIRC the issue with having to press the button to remove the key is related to the same/similar wiring the neutral start switch is. You may have some broken wires underneath the shift lever inside the center console causing both issues.

 

Take the starter off and test it at an autoparts store if thats your main suspect.

[98gpgt]

ok got the console off the other night, haven't done much else (yeah I'm slow). I will check the wires. If that ain't the trouble, I'll troubleshoot further.

 

Ebay has 35$ starters shipped. Ok there aren't a lot of fans of cheapo asian parts. But is a starter the worst thing you can buy off ebay? I still get to keep my old one and possibly rebuild it, that is if it's the problem. Just trying to plan ahead.

[98gpgt]

Could this be the whole problem? Both green-white and purple-white wires are detached.

[rich_e777]

Its possible but we need to know what those wires are for, Ive got a manual around somewhere that should have the schematics.

[cheatah faheatah]

I think all your trouble can be traced back to that packet of salt.....lol.

[Imp558]

I'm out today, I'll post the schematics later this evening and we'll see what those two wires are. Looks like Green/White, Violet/White to the shifter?

[Imp558]

Those two wires are nothing to do with this, they are the sterring column lock and the solenoid that keeps you from shifting out of park without stepping on the brakes.

 

I'd jump that starter or jump a wire from the battery to the little purple wire on the starter to see if the starter works.

[Imp558]

[98gpgt]

Is this what is meant by jumping the starter (shorting across 2 starter relay terminals)?:

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SNLcW7FhQFw

[55trucker]

Negative,

 

one uses a remote control starter or a screwdriver to bridge the terminals *on* the starter.

 

You're bypassing all of the ign. switch related wiring & going straight to the starter to test it.

 

One lead connects to the large battery point & the other to the smaller solenoid terminal.

 

 

 

[98gpgt]

OK but jumper in inside the relay box may indicate whether the starter works or not. I don't have 1 of those, could improvise I guess. I'm thinking at this point it's the neutral safety switch or the starter. Got to go to sleep, yes I said it, and get up when there's some light left. And thanks for all the inputs.

[Imp558]

There's two studs with wiires, just touch a screwdriver across them. It'll make a spark and hopefully the engine will turn over. If you touch the engine with the screwdriver it'll make a big bad spark so be careful only to touch the two terminals with the screwdriver.

[98gpgt]

I'm back. There's 2 large studs on the solenoid, and a smaller 1, all 3 have wires. I'm looking at this:

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv0zjxp6654

 

and he's saying hot (red, larger stud) goes to a smaller wire/stud?, but it's not clear what he has. I put a test light on all 3 lugs, and see nothing. I have the starter now, but it may not even be that ...

 

 

 

OK looked at the Haynes manual, the smaller terminal is what you have to short to the juice terminal (red), i take it. Wondering if there's even anything getting to the starter. Maybe a fusible link if that's the case?

[55trucker]

The terminals you are concerned with are the large *battery* stud that your heavy wiring is connected to & the small ign/solenoid terminal.

 

The 2nd large stud (close to the main body) is the contact stud that along with the 1st heavy stud *closes* the circuit to the armature inside the starter, those two make & break via a round contact disc that moves back & forth along with the iron core inside the solenoid.

 

One turns the key, the solenoid windings ground, the electromagnetic field moves the core, the contacts close, the armature begins to spin & the *bendix* drive on the back end of the armature shaft pushes the gear out into the flywheel gear.

 

If the solenoid windings have failed or the contact disc has worn away there will one or two responses when one *shorts/bridges* the solenoid terminal to the the large battery terminal,

 

1. no response

2. the solenoid closes, the the armature does not spin but you hear the bendix drive moving.

[Imp558]

I put a test light on all 3 lugs, and see nothing.

 

 

Dead battery? You should have power on the stud with the big wire from the battery.

[98gpgt]

Don't think so. Certainly not dead. Lights come on when I open the doors. Can't find my mm, got to go shopping, may pick up a load tester at wmart just to have. We'll see ...

[Imp558]

There's a huge wire directly connecting the battery to the big starter stud, if the test light is dead on that stud the battery is dead or that battery cable if crapoop.

[98gpgt]

I figured as much. It's a question of whether I'm using the slightly funky tl correctly (it works, but I had the coiled wire wrapped around the clear housing, and something may have leaked onto it, as the wire was partially fused to the housing, even made an indentation! Didn't even think to look for a new one at Wallyworld.). There's also considerable rust on those terminals. I only have so much daylight due to the weird hours I keep. I really don't want to be in such a vulnerable position late at night. Something furry is liable to bite me on the keester.

[98gpgt]

Any opinions on this Schumacher Battery Tester? Just wondering if it's worth holding onto even if it's not needed for this job. BT-100, 35$.