Failed attempt at installing leaf spring isolator pad.

[snippits]

My 92 Cutlass Supreme S still has some clunking noise in the rear. After I got the new struts on, I inspected the ends of the leaf spring where it goes into the knuckle, and there was absolutely nothing on either end of the spring. The factory rubber is completely gone on both sides.

 

I tried to install the Moog transverse spring isolator pads. Put the rear on jack stands, used a block of wood and a six inch c-clamp to try to get the spring to raise out of the knuckle, but I could not get close enough to the end of the spring to raise it up enough. That dang trailing arm sits there right in the way. I don't have any air impacts, so I knew it was going to be a bear to break that bolt with a 15/16 inch wrench or big breaker bar and impact socket. Well I could not budge it. The only thing that broke loose was a rib of mine that made a popping sound. Heck it might even be cracked. I am pushing 60 years old, so I just can't get her done like I use to do.

 

Guess I will swing by the garage Monday morning, and let them put it on. I just don't see any way to install that pad without removing the trailing arm.

Edited July 24, 2015 by LukeZ34

[vipmiller803]

The only thing that broke loose was a rib of mine that made a popping sound. Heck it might even be cracked. I am pushing 60 years old, so I just can't get her done like I use to do.

Ouch that sounds painful. I am not sure how condoned this is, but I have had good luck simply placing the floor jack under a piece of wood under the spring itself. It might get a little cramped in there, but it will get the job done. It worked on a three leaf spring for me so I have no doubt it would work on the composite monoleaf.

[snippits]

Yes it hurt like a mofo. Felt like I got hit in the ribs with a ball bat.

 

I tried a jack with block of wood, and the same problem just can't get close enough to the end of the spring because of the trailing arm being in the way.

 

Without removing the trailing arm, the only other way that might work would be to unloosen and remove the top strut mount bolts, and then that will cause the knuckle to drop down a good bit. And then put a jack with block of wood under the trailing arm and jack it up to get the spring to center in the knuckle. Not sure if it would work or not.

[19Cutlass94]

It would be easier to remove the trailing arm. That's how I got mine out. Removed both trailing arms, and the leaf was basically loose. You'll just have to jack up the knuckle to get the trailing arm back on.

[vipmiller803]

I had the car on the ground (as opposed to on stands) when I did it. I am not sure if that put more of the weight on the mounting pads of the spring or what, but it gave me the right clearance to pop that puck in there. There are actual spring compressors for those springs. I have a feeling you might have to remove the jack pad for it to install. Something like this:

[snippits]

I wish I had that spring compressor because then I could just remove the whole spring, and then put the rubber pads back on.

Since I don't have any air impacts, I think my best bet is just got to the garage, and let them do it. I need an impact, and thought about running down to Sears, and buying the new C3 heavy duty 1/2 inch drive cordless impact 300 ft. lbs. for $159.00, but I am not sure it would break that trailing arm bolt loose. It would be nice to have for lugs though and other bolts.

I do remember though when I was working on the right rear strut, and I had not installed the top two strut mount bolts yet, and I saw that the leaf spring was sitting in the the center of the knuckle perfectly for an isolator pad install. That's why I mentioned taking the top strut mounts loose to see if I could get the spring to center in the knuckle. It might have just been dumb luck though, and probably not with the effort to save a dollar.

Edited July 24, 2015 by LukeZ34

[19Cutlass94]

That's where you need a long pipe on the end of a breaker bar.

[Cutlass350]

I need an impact, and thought about running down to Sears, and buying the new C3 heavy duty 1/2 inch drive cordless impact 300 ft. lbs. for $159.00, but I am not sure it would break that trailing arm bolt loose. It would be nice to have for lugs though and other bolts.

 

Don't waste your money.

 

I've bought a number of impact wrenches over the years. I have a "few" electric and battery ones.

Fwiw, I love DeWalt products, except for their under-powered impact wrenches (all of them - electric and battery).

 

If you're going to use a non air-powered impact wrench, I've found only two that I've owned to be worth anything.

An older "Harbor Freight" $50 electric that I got when I when I was in college (yea, WTF!?! Maybe I got a fluke?), and a Milwaukee electric.

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000647GA

Milwaukee 9072-20 1/2-Inch Impact Wrench

Price: ~$200

 

Btw, my local Home Depot, and Sears often have the Milwaukee Impact Wrench in stock. Check yours.

[Cutlass350]

Btw, snap-on makes some nice 3/8" ratchets with looong handles. Not cheap.

But, you may find a used on on ebay for a non super high price. I got two different ones (used). Imho, I find them better than using a pipe. It's more compact, and there isn't a pipe that moves/wiggles around while you're doing some ratcheting.

 

The ones that I got:

Snap-On Ratchet Sealed Head Dual 80 Extra Long Handle 3/8" Drive 17 1/2" FLL80 (~~$80 used in good shape)

 

 

 

Snap On 3/8" Drive Long Handle Sealed Ratchet FL830 (~10" ; ~~$55 used in good shape)

Couldn't find a good static image to link, so here's an ebay link to a search:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?&_nkw=fl830+snap+on

 

 

Yea, getting old sucks. That's why I now buy $$ tools. So, that I can do stuff, with more ease.

Btw, cordless butane-powered framing nailer guns - ROCK!! Use a hammer to drive in a 3" nail? Ha, ha, ha!

I can put over a 100 3" nails, with glue and barbs on the end, and not work up a sweat. Yawn, you want me to put in 100 more nails, yawn, wait until I finish my non-alcoholic (never use power tools and drink!) margarita. Yawn.

 

Paslode Cordless Framing Nailer CF325Li (Uncompensated Review and Demo)

 

Good Luck!

Edited July 12, 2015 by Cutlass350

[Heartbeat1991]

I have a pneumatic 600 ft/lbs impact that won't budge my trailing arm bolts. I don't expect a 300 ft/lbs cordless is going to cut it.

[rich_e777]

That's where you need a long pipe on the end of a breaker bar.

 

Works awesome, I`d recommend taking your socket wrench(es) to hardware or plumbing store that sells lengths of steel pipe and selecting a 4-6ft piece that you can get your wrench in. With a 6ft piece I can break rear knuckle bolts, trailing arm bolts and probably lateral link and those big strut bolts in the towers loose easy. I thought about getting a 1/2 and 3/8 socket wrenches welded or epoxied in to either end to eliminate that wiggle room.

 

(never use power tools and drink!)

 

 

:thumbsup:2nd

 

but now we need to discuss this non-alcoholic margarita and how it can exist.

[snippits]

I have a pneumatic 600 ft/lbs impact that won't budge my trailing arm bolts. I don't expect a 300 ft/lbs cordless is going to cut it.

 

Dang that bolt is on there good. The bolt on mine just has the normal surface rust, and the car stays in the south, so no bad rust at all. I soaked it good too with Kroil.

 

A friend of mine said I could use his impact gear that he used to work on tractor trailers. He was an owner operator, and he did his own repairs. I asked him if he had something bigger than 600 ft/lbs, and he said he had a 1100 ft/lbs Ingersoll Rand. He also said that the bolt was going to come off or break with that much reverse torque.

[RobertISaar]

I have a pneumatic 600 ft/lbs impact that won't budge my trailing arm bolts. I don't expect a 300 ft/lbs cordless is going to cut it.

 

for another point of reference, i had to resort to a 750 ft-lb snap-on impact AND heat from a MAPP torch to get mine out.

[snippits]

for another point of reference, i had to resort to a 750 ft-lb snap-on impact AND heat from a MAPP torch to get mine out.

 

Thanks for the information.

 

When and if I can get the trailing arm bolt off, it will definitely have anti-seize applied to the bolt threads.

[pitzel]

Wow, so much work described above. What I did was simply use a 3 ton floor jack and a 3/4 foot long section of 2x4 lumber. Apply the 2x4 to the spring between the lateral arms, laterally. And start lifting the floor jack until the leaf spring has lifted out of its mount. Insert the puck, give it a it of a hit with a hammer or something if it doesn't seat all the way, and you should be good. A bottle jack or a smaller floor jack should work just fine too, but that's what I had on hand.

 

I've removed and installed them without even taking the tires off. Just make sure you have a pry bar and a hammer as you really don't want your fingers to be anywhere near for safety's sake!

 

Edit: here's a Youtube video of the trailing arm removal/replacement which may be of assistance.

 

[video=youtube;AExLuqMBA6k]

Edited July 13, 2015 by pitzel

[snippits]

Thanks for that video. Looks exactly like mine minus the rust!

 

I did it like you say, and my spring just will not raise up enough to get the puck in there. When I used the jack, if I did not get the block of wood close as I could to the end of the spring, and that was as far as the trailing arm would let me, then the block of wood would start walking to the center of the spring because of the bow shape.

 

I think I have an idea though. To stop the block of wood from walking to the center of the spring. Take my c-clamp and use two blocks of wood to protect the bottom and top of the spring, and then compress the c-clamp, and use it as a stop to stop the floor jack and wood block from walking toward the center of the spring. Hope I explained it good enough. I don't know why I did not think of that before now. Once the spring starts to level out where it's being jacked, it will quit trying to walk since it will be closer to being level.

[Galaxie500XL]

What I did with mine was use a rectangular piece of wood, about 1.5 inches wide, and around 8 inches long. I aligned the wood lengthwise along the spring. There seemed to be enough friction between the spring and the wood to allow me to jack up the spring without the wood moving very much, at least far enough to get the job done.

[vipmiller803]

I think I have an idea though. To stop the block of wood from walking to the center of the spring. Take my c-clamp and use two blocks of wood to protect the bottom and top of the spring, and then compress the c-clamp, and use it as a stop to stop the floor jack and wood block from walking toward the center of the spring. Hope I explained it good enough. I don't know why I did not think of that before now. Once the spring starts to level out where it's being jacked, it will quit trying to walk since it will be closer to being level.

Not a bad idea. That clamp won't have to be super tight to stop the walking. Again, if the spring is compressed to start with (the car is on the ground), the extent of the spring bowing would be much lower, and that might help with the walking too.

 

Also, I don't think anyone mentioned this and you may already know this: when you are loosening the trailing arm bolt, you are loosening the nut right? Once that is loose, getting the bolt out would be the next step.

[snippits]

Not a bad idea. That clamp won't have to be super tight to stop the walking. Again, if the spring is compressed to start with (the car is on the ground), the extent of the spring bowing would be much lower, and that might help with the walking too.

 

Also, I don't think anyone mentioned this and you may already know this: when you are loosening the trailing arm bolt, you are loosening the nut right? Once that is loose, getting the bolt out would be the next step.

 

Yes I was loosening the nut!

[Schurkey]

I am completely mystified as to why an impact wrench is needed to slam the plastic blocks into place. A floor- or bottle-jack, a 2X4, or a fabricated spring compressor as described in the link below, and half-an-hour is all you need.

 

For the record, I am now of the opinion that the rubber pads on the ends of the leaf are essential. The plastic blocks will lift the rear about half-an-inch, but they don't replace the rubber pads. Replacement rubber pads are available from Dorman.

 

http://www.w-body.com/showthread.php/21004-Monoleaf-Pad-Thread-%28Part-Number-and-HowTo-Inside%29?p=969801&viewfull=1#post969801

Edited July 13, 2015 by Schurkey

[snippits]

I took the car to the garage today to get the pucks installed. None of the mechanics had seen, or done the job using the pucks, but they said they could do it. Mechanic tried to jack up on the spring, and it just kept walking to the center. He took off the trailing arm bolt , and he still could not get the spring to raise enough. Next thing I know I heard the impact working, and he had the whole hub off the knuckle. It took him a good while to get the hub back on with the puck installed.

 

On the other side, he had the puck put on fast because he got the diesel mechanic to come and take a look at it, and he brought over what looked like a 6 ft. pry bar. By the time I got back from the bathroom they had the puck in. Took the mechanic at least an hour on one side, and 10 minutes on the other side.

I just don't know how you guys are doing it with just a jack and block of wood, but it just did not happen with my car. It was a big pain in the butt all around for me and the mechanic. If it had not been for the diesel mechanic, I would have been sitting there a heck of a lot longer.

Anyway, thanks for the help with it, and hopefully the next puck installation by who ever will not be a big PITA like mine was.

 

Edit: The good news. No more clunking noise after the puck install. I had installed new Garbriel loaded struts prior to the puck install that did not stop the clunking.

 

The bad news. My left rear trailing arm was bent. Nobody had one in stock locally, so the mechanic straightened it the best he could. Looks a lot better than it was.

Edited July 23, 2015 by snippits

[snippits]

I am completely mystified as to why an impact wrench is needed to slam the plastic blocks into place. A floor- or bottle-jack, a 2X4, or a fabricated spring compressor as described in the link below, and half-an-hour is all you need.

 

For the record, I am now of the opinion that the rubber pads on the ends of the leaf are essential. The plastic blocks will lift the rear about half-an-inch, but they don't replace the rubber pads. Replacement rubber pads are available from Dorman.

 

http://www.w-body.com/showthread.php/21004-Monoleaf-Pad-Thread-%28Part-Number-and-HowTo-Inside%29?p=969801&viewfull=1#post969801

 

That tool you fabricated would have made the job so much easier. Nice!!

 

I know I could have put rubber pads in there, but for now that dang clunking noise has stopped, and I will inspect the pucks often to see what's going on.

[vipmiller803]

I just don't know how you guys are doing it with just a jack and block of wood, but it just did not happen with my car. It was a big pain in the butt all around for me and the mechanic. If it had not been for the diesel mechanic, I would have been sitting there a heck of a lot longer.

Maybe your spring was just in a much better shape than everyone else's? Super fortified? Either way, congrats on the noise elimination.

 

The bad news. My left rear trailing arm was bent. Nobody had one in stock locally, so the mechanic straightened it the best he could. Looks a lot better than it was.

Probably best to get that replaced. Those things love to break...

 

I know I could have put rubber pads in there, but for now that dang clunking noise has stopped, and I will inspect the pucks often to see what's going on.

People complain about them wearing the spring down after 50k miles.

[snippits]

Found a couple of PDF"s from NAPA chassis.  Notice the spring compressor tool that is being used.  Looks to be custom fabricated.

 

 

http://www.napachassis.com/docs/librariesprovider3/2002-tech-bulletin/ces-02-23-composite-spring-insulator-pad-rear-suspension.pdf?sfvrsn=4

 

http://www.napachassis.com/docs/librariesprovider3/2003-tech-bulletin/ces-03-16-gm-w-body-car-rear-spring-end-replacement.pdf?sfvrsn=4

[Nas Escobar]

Yeah there's a how to floating around here about that custom tool. Shurkey made one for himself and left pics on how to do it.