91 Lumina Euro

[juggalette717]

Hey guys I'm Jenifer. I joined up cuz im trying to get some advice on my car so i can get it running again. I have a 1991 Chevy Lumina Euro 3.1

[Galaxie500XL]

Welcome to W-Body Jennifer! Nice car! My brother-in-law had a Lumina Euro he drove well past 360,000 miles, so you've got a solid foundation to build on.

[94 olds vert]

Welcome to the site. Tons of good info around here.

[j_mezz]

Welcome! What's it's major malfunction?

[Philbo Baggins]

It's probably either the flux capacitor of the blinker fluid

[redgrandprix]

Good lookin car! This forum has been most helpful for information too me, on a side note i actually knew a girl who was convinced by another person that blinker fluid was a real thing.... i HIGHLY doubt that is the case here

[juggalette717]

We've done replaced the coil packs, ignition control module, spark plugs and wires, fuel injectors, crank sensor, and the computer. It will spin over, but will not fire at all. I believe it's something simple, but we just cant figure it out. Any advice would be helpful =/

[Philbo Baggins]

Your car has a different motor from mine, so maybe this won't mean anything... but on mine on the driver side of the engine bay there is a fuel pump relay, next to that relay is a 20A fuse that likes to blow and make the car not fire up. On mine, i replaced it with a 25A fuse and it stopped blowing and solved the issue. The fuse in question is an ECM fuse. If that relay is done you won't get fuel...if that little ECM fuse is fried you won't get spark (and maybe also not fuel i'm not sure on that). Step one should always be fuses and relays (the AC relay and fuel pump relay are usually the same and sometimes can be tested by swapping them). Coil packs and ignition modules tend to derp out on these cars so replacing those might have been a good idea anyway. In fact all the things you replaced might have been worth replacing.

 

Other common issues are the fuel pump, wire harness into the fuel pump, and wire connector at the ECM (as opposed to the ECM itself). Early 90s was just barely emerging from the Dark Years in terms of automotive electronics so sensors, computers, and electric fuel pumps are hit or miss in terms of reliability

 

Also take a thorough inspection of the wiring harness leading into the ignition module if you haven't done so yet.

[Euro]

Welcome! How's the battery?

[Philbo Baggins]

Good lookin car! This forum has been most helpful for information too me, on a side note i actually knew a girl who was convinced by another person that blinker fluid was a real thing.... i HIGHLY doubt that is the case here

 

One of my old bosses used to be like "did you check the blinker fluid?" every time someone had a car problem. I've also heard of someone (didn't meet them) who was convinced to go to a repair shop and ask them to replace the flux capacitor.

[Galaxie500XL]

Have you confirmed you have spark? If so, the next thing I'd be looking at would be if you have fuel pressure, and injector pulses. Start simple first.

We've done replaced the coil packs, ignition control module, spark plugs and wires, fuel injectors, crank sensor, and the computer. It will spin over, but will not fire at all. I believe it's something simple, but we just cant figure it out. Any advice would be helpful =/

[BrianG]

Welcome! Sorry to hear about the troubles. Can you hear the fuel pump prime when you turn the key to the ON position? Have you checked for fuel pressure at the fuel rail? ICMs are common to go, so that would have been my first suggestion, but you have that covered already.

[juggalette717]

Welcome! Sorry to hear about the troubles. Can you hear the fuel pump prime when you turn the key to the ON position? Have you checked for fuel pressure at the fuel rail? ICMs are common to go, so that would have been my first suggestion, but you have that covered already.

 

Yeah i can hear the fuel pump cut on when i turn the key and it is getting fuel to the fuel rail. Idk what is wrong with it =/

[Crazy K]

Being a 3.1 mpfi, the issues the commonly cause such a no start in no particular order are Injectors, Crank sensor, Ignition Control Module, fuel pump.

 

I've had all these kill a car in it's tracks, as a few members here can attest to with a certain evil car that got stranded on an on ramp to I-70 a few years ago.

 

first thing i would do is spark test:

take an extra plug wire (if possible, or you will have to unhook the plug wire end of each wire) and shove a screwdriver into it. Lay that on top of the engine and swap the other end for each coil end. crank the engine and see if each of the six coil point sends a spark though.

 

 

 

IF NO SPARK: ignition issue

 

if no spark on all six, you have likely a bad crank sensor, or bad ICM, though i have seen a bad Engine Control Module/Powertrain Control Module (ECM/PCM/computer) cause the same issue, but that particular case the ECM/PCM/computer was missing it's cover and was full of water!!?!?!?!!!!

 

a bad ICM, which is located under the coils. You can get the same module and coils from any 3.1/3.4 dohc/3100/3400 at the junkyard. the best come from ones on top of the motor. I just swap them if they are questionable since I now have a box full.

 

Bad crank sensor, located in rear of engine block. it's plastic and it cracked and corroded. it is connected by the yellow and purple wires going to a single connector on the ICM. you should be able to do a noid test with a bulb as described in the fuel injector section that follows to see if the signal is getting through. no signal = ICM not told to fire the coils.

 

 

 

IF YES SPARK: fuel issue

 

1 Injector test:

http://easyautodiagnostics.com/tool_review_noidlight/fuel_injector_noidlight_1.php

you can unhook the injector connector you can see under the intake near the oil cap, as well as the one by the power steering pump without pulling the plenum/intake. For a noid light, you can grab one of the two prong little lights, such as used to light above the driver and passenger feet or even the trunk's light bulb and bend the prongs out so that it can be plugged in place of the injector on the circuit.

 

2 injector resistance test

use a multimeter to test the injectors. they should all be in close range and be around 11.5 to 13 ohms. if you were to find one that was really out of spec, it would short the car computer out causing your issue. two injectors can be tested without removing the Plenum(upper intake), but the other require removal. My road side emergency was caused by a shorted out fuel injector. I unhooked the failed injector and drove the car 150 miles home on five cylinders.

 

3 fuel pump test

autozone has a rental gauge tool. $$$ to rent, but you get it all back when done. Should have info with the rental kit on pressure specification. It should be somewhere between 45 and 60 psi, but that should be in the book with the kit, along with instructions

 

 

this help?

Edited October 8, 2013 by Crazy K

[juggalette717]

Being a 3.1 mpfi, the issues the commonly cause such a no start in no particular order are Injectors, Crank sensor, Ignition Control Module, fuel pump.

 

I've had all these kill a car in it's tracks, as a few members here can attest to with a certain evil car that got stranded on an on ramp to I-70 a few years ago.

 

first thing i would do is spark test:

take an extra plug wire (if possible, or you will have to unhook the plug wire end of each wire) and shove a screwdriver into it. Lay that on top of the engine and swap the other end for each coil end. crank the engine and see if each of the six coil point sends a spark though.

 

 

 

IF NO SPARK: ignition issue

 

if no spark on all six, you have likely a bad crank sensor, or bad ICM, though i have seen a bad Engine Control Module/Powertrain Control Module (ECM/PCM/computer) cause the same issue, but that particular case the ECM/PCM/computer was missing it's cover and was full of water!!?!?!?!!!!

 

a bad ICM, which is located under the coils. You can get the same module and coils from any 3.1/3.4 dohc/3100/3400 at the junkyard. the best come from ones on top of the motor. I just swap them if they are questionable since I now have a box full.

 

Bad crank sensor, located in rear of engine block. it's plastic and it cracked and corroded. it is connected by the yellow and purple wires going to a single connector on the ICM. you should be able to do a noid test with a bulb as described in the fuel injector section that follows to see if the signal is getting through. no signal = ICM not told to fire the coils.

 

 

 

IF YES SPARK: fuel issue

 

1 Injector test:

http://easyautodiagnostics.com/tool_review_noidlight/fuel_injector_noidlight_1.php

you can unhook the injector connector you can see under the intake near the oil cap, as well as the one by the power steering pump without pulling the plenum/intake. For a noid light, you can grab one of the two prong little lights, such as used to light above the driver and passenger feet or even the trunk's light bulb and bend the prongs out so that it can be plugged in place of the injector on the circuit.

 

2 injector resistance test

use a multimeter to test the injectors. they should all be in close range and be around 11.5 to 13 ohms. if you were to find one that was really out of spec, it would short the car computer out causing your issue. two injectors can be tested without removing the Plenum(upper intake), but the other require removal. My road side emergency was caused by a shorted out fuel injector. I unhooked the failed injector and drove the car 150 miles home on five cylinders.

 

3 fuel pump test

autozone has a rental gauge tool. $$$ to rent, but you get it all back when done. Should have info with the rental kit on pressure specification. It should be somewhere between 45 and 60 psi, but that should be in the book with the kit, along with instructions

 

 

this help?

 

It not firing at all. The ICM is brand new, so is the crank sensor and the coils, wires, and plugs

[l67ss]

Check the condition of the wire harness my monte did the same thing ended up bein a short in the pcm fuse box wiring

Btw

<also down with the clown

It not firing at all. The ICM is brand new, so is the crank sensor and the coils, wires, and plugs

[Crazy K]

It not firing at all. The ICM is brand new, so is the crank sensor and the coils, wires, and plugs

 

Define "will not fire" That means nothing as it is unclear. Have you tested for spark as I described? Spark should be blue and even between all six.

 

 

If an injector has failed, it could actually short out the PCM. It may cause a condition of no spark by disabling the computer...

[juggalette717]

Define "will not fire" That means nothing as it is unclear. Have you tested for spark as I described? Spark should be blue and even between all six.

 

 

If an injector has failed, it could actually short out the PCM. It may cause a condition of no spark by disabling the computer...

 

No spark on any of them. and the injectors are all new

[juggalette717]

Check the condition of the wire harness my monte did the same thing ended up bein a short in the pcm fuse box wiring

Btw

<also down with the clown

 

Whoop whoop

[skitchin]

What up ninja

[l67ss]

So you like my cooouuuch?!

[skitchin]

YOU CAN'T HAVE MY COUCH! YOU MOTHAFUCKA!!!!

[l67ss]

Roflmao

YOU CAN'T HAVE MY COUCH! YOU MOTHAFUCKA!!!!

[Crazy K]

there is a yellow and purple wire running from the crank sensor to the ICM. if that wire has degraded or is damaged, the car will not run. check for continuity with a volt meter

 

the PCM has a chip inside that must match the vehicle. was it transferred from the old computer?

 

if you turn the key to the to the run position you can check for the reason for a check engine light.

http://www.streetdirectory.com/travel_guide/56868/car_parts/obd1_codes_secrets_for_check_engine_light.html

even if no codes are present, you should still get a flashing "12", which indicates the PCM is functional. try that to see if it works.

[juggalette717]

there is a yellow and purple wire running from the crank sensor to the ICM. if that wire has degraded or is damaged, the car will not run. check for continuity with a volt meter

 

the PCM has a chip inside that must match the vehicle. was it transferred from the old computer?

 

if you turn the key to the to the run position you can check for the reason for a check engine light.

http://www.streetdirectory.com/travel_guide/56868/car_parts/obd1_codes_secrets_for_check_engine_light.html

even if no codes are present, you should still get a flashing "12", which indicates the PCM is functional. try that to see if it works.

 

The only code its throwing is 12. I will check the wires and let you know