PTAaron Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Okay, I have a problem that seems to be present around 50% of the time that I get into the car. When I turn the key to start the car I will get a solid "click" sound from the engine compartment, then nothing. If this happens it usually takes 2-10 times of me turning from "run" to "start" or "off" to "start" until the starter finally engages and the car starts. The other 50% of the time the car just starts on the first attempt. There is no rhyme or reason to it - doesn't matter if the car is hot, cold, or if it was just shut down - it may or may not start the next time. Before I go and spend $90-100 on a new starter - I want to make sure I eliminate any other potential culprits... What else should I be checking? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revnrob Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 My car does the same thing,,,Ithas a known bad solenoid causeing that to happen,,,,would try hitting the pickNpull and grab one.. my first guess... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 not that it's fun to get to, but check out the VATS relay, perhaps swap it with a known good one. if it starts acting up, the starter is disabled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadfoot Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Mine did this and got worse over the last year or 2. It used to be that I would occasionally get that "click" to where it was about 50% of the time. When this happened the starter was only getting about 9 volts. I rigged up a push button that was connected to a relay that would activate the starter for those times when it had to start. 2 weeks ago it got to where it wouldn't click and if I used the button it will start the car and it immediately dies. I am assuming this is because of the ignition switch, but I haven't had time to dig into it yet. revnrob...what solenoid are you referring too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 start followed by immediate stall sounds exactly like a VATS issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadfoot Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 start followed by immediate stall sounds exactly like a VATS issue. It wasn't a start with the key. It wouldn't start with the key, but then I used a switch I wired up that is independent of all of the cars ignition wiring. It would start with that switch, but die immediately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 the PCM depends upon a signal from the VATS module, without it, it will not fire the injectors beyond the 2 second window the PCM alllows for the signal to be present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galaxie500XL Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Robert, could the PCM be reprogrammed to simply disable VATS? I doubt many people are serious about stealing 20+ year old cars... the PCM depends upon a signal from the VATS module, without it, it will not fire the injectors beyond the 2 second window the PCM alllows for the signal to be present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 doable. either that or make a signal generator, either method is pretty well documented by now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revnrob Posted July 13, 2013 Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 revnrob...what solenoid are you referring too? The Solenoid on the starter,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTAaron Posted July 15, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2013 Thanks fo the info! I do occasionally get a "security" light on the dash - but it isn't consistently there when the car is not starting. I guess I'll start with checking the voltage at the starter. Any more info on how you rigged up that switch Leadfoot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTAaron Posted July 15, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2013 I found this info on bypassing the VATS system: http://vats.likeabigdog.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadfoot Posted July 15, 2013 Report Share Posted July 15, 2013 revnrob...what solenoid are you referring too? The Solenoid on the starter,,, Ok, the starter and solenoid was replaced after this problem began, but was less frequent and made no change. It needed to be changed anyway so no worries. I need to find time to dig into this. For the OP, I tore my column down and found the wires for the VATS worn bare at the ignition tumbler so I replaced it. It didn't fix it, but needed to be replaced. I have read that can cause these issues as well. As mentioned here, the wire (purple or yellow depending on location) can go bad or a corroded connections. Also the Nuetral Safety Switch can be bad or just out of adjusment. Not too mention VATS. Several possible things have come up in my research. A good multimeter and some patience can go a long way in helping narrow it down. I haven't had too much time all at once when mine would act up to diagnose it. I have had to do it piecemeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTAaron Posted July 15, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2013 Thanks for the info! This morning I decided to just try using my other ignition key - and out of 3 times starting the car (leaving for the gym, heading home from the gym, and leaving for work) I only had the "Click" happen once. Of course on the way to work the ABS and BRAKE warning lights were both on for the first time the entire ride... so that's fun. I'm probably going to start poking around with a multimeter this weekend. Thanks for all the ideas everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTAaron Posted July 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2013 Thanks for the info! This morning I decided to just try using my other ignition key - and out of 3 times starting the car (leaving for the gym, heading home from the gym, and leaving for work) I only had the "Click" happen once. Of course on the way to work the ABS and BRAKE warning lights were both on for the first time the entire ride... so that's fun. I'm probably going to start poking around with a multimeter this weekend. Thanks for all the ideas everyone. Turns the different key didn't solve it... but I have learned that positioning the key "just right" in the ignition is the trick. This tells me that it is definitely the VATS that is the issue - so I may just go ahead and make myself a VATS bypass and not have to worry about it anymore! For the time being if it "clicks" I can just pull the key back out a few millimeters and it will start. Thanks again everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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