No start - no crank.

[WhatTheFehl]

I've been trying to figure out what exactly the heck could have caused what happened to me yesterday. I dropped off the Outback Tuesday night to have some non-emergency work done on it, and I had planned to DD the Grand Prix again temporarily until the Outback was fixed. I drove it to work Wednesday Morning, started fine and drove fine. Then I went to lunch Wednesday Afternoon and it started and drove fine then. Then finally I go to leave work to go home Wednesday Night, get in the car, turn the key, everything lights up as normal, but it does not start. In fact it does not even crank. It does not even CLICK! Okay, is it fully in park... Check. Is every power accessory turned off... Check. Try again... same thing. Okay, coast it down the hill, it is low on fuel so maybe since I am parked facing downhill it isn't getting enough fuel... try again... same thing. Okay, put it in neutral, try again. Still nothing. Okay, let's try the remote starter. The remote starter just keeps going through the cycle again and again, each time the car fails to start.

 

My initial thoughts were that I fried the fuel pump, the car was very low on fuel, I had planned on stopping for gas at the station around the corner from where I work on the way home. But then I turn the key again... I can hear the fuel pump prime. I let it sit a few minutes and try again to get it to start... still go through the same process. Alright, at this point I ran out of give-a-damn, it was less than 30 degrees out and I wanted to go home. So I left a note, dropped the keys in the key drop at work, hopped in a coworker's car and he gave me a ride home. I figured at this point it must be the starter that was toast.

 

This morning (I was off from work) I go down to the mechanic who normally services my family's vehicles, tell him what happened, and tell him that I need the Outback back ASAP. From there I go out to work to see if they had figured out anything with my car yet. Apparently, it started right up on the first try and they drove it inside. Then it started right up for me when I was there. I promptly drove it to the gas station, got gas, drove it home, picked up my uncle, drove back to work so he could pick up our van that I had been driving today, and then drove back home and parked it, only shutting it off once I was at home. I have started it about 6 times since returning home and each time it has started perfect.

 

So my basic question here is... what could possibly cause this?

 

I'm thinking the VATS system is freaking out. My security light started coming on a couple months ago, it comes and goes. One day its on, one day it isn't. Never had a problem with starting the car. I had always assumed it had been bypassed anyway as the vehicle has a remote starter that was, as far as I can tell, installed when the car was new or just a few years old. But I really wonder at this point. A few weeks ago I decided to finally break down and get a copy of my ignition key made, as up till this point I've only had one ignition key, and I wanted to have a key for each of the family's vehicles on my main key ring. So I opted for one without a chip. Low and behold it doesn't work, the key was identical in every way but did not have a chip. So then I have one with a chip made and it works perfectly. No, the security light was not flashing when the car would not start, it was steady on, just like normal start up test. If it makes a difference, the key I had last night was the original ignition key I got with the car when I bought it. I haven't used the new key at all this entire time. I kind of wondered if switching back and forth between the new key and old key may have confused the system, but I really think I'm reaching at this point. I don't know where to turn.

[95 vert]

It's the Vats (key). I've had this happen a few times and usually I'll wipe the chip down with something (fingers, napkin, whatever's handy) put it back in and the vehicle will crank.

[skitchin]

Yes sir, it's the security system or the key. I wouldn't worry about it unless it becomes a further problem. My car has done it several times over the years. Sometimes it'd do it once every few months, but then go years without giving me any issue. Each time though, I just turn the key off, wait anywhere between 30 seconds to two minutes and it usually fires right up.

[white4d96]

Same problem here, I bypassed the reader in the ignition switch with a resistor pack.

[WhatTheFehl]

That's all well and good, fine its the VATS. But, how on earth is the remote starter functioning if the VATS isn't already bypassed?

[Leo090]

Get a copy of your current key quick before it loses its voltage code. Had this happened to me after 10 yrs of using the same key.

[Artemis]

That's all well and good, fine its the VATS. But, how on earth is the remote starter functioning if the VATS isn't already bypassed?

 

Did you install the remote starter? If not, the installer would've installed a bypass. I have a bypass and a remote starter, and I get the exact same problem you get on occasion. Total pain in the ass. I just wait between 5-10 mins and it will fire right up and not do it again for quite some time. I believe its the actual vats module.

[Schurkey]

it does not even crank. It does not even CLICK! Okay, is it fully in park... Check. Is every power accessory turned off... Check. Try again... same thing. Okay, coast it down the hill, it is low on fuel so maybe since I am parked facing downhill it isn't getting enough fuel... try again... same thing. Okay, put it in neutral, try again. Still nothing. Okay, let's try the remote starter. The remote starter just keeps going through the cycle again and again, each time the car fails to start.

 

My initial thoughts were that I fried the fuel pump, the car was very low on fuel, I had planned on stopping for gas at the station around the corner from where I work on the way home. But then I turn the key again... I can hear the fuel pump prime...

 

...it started right up on the first try and they drove it inside. Then it started right up for me when I was there. I promptly drove it to the gas station, got gas, drove it home, picked up my uncle, drove back to work so he could pick up our van that I had been driving today, and then drove back home and parked it, only shutting it off once I was at home. I have started it about 6 times since returning home and each time it has started perfect.

 

So my basic question here is... what could possibly cause this?

IS THE BATTERY FULLY CHARGED??? 12.6--12.7 volts across the terminals with NO load? If not, CHARGE THE BATTERY FIRST before screwing with ANYTHING else.

 

1. Low on gas or "accessories turned off" has N-O-T-H-I-N-G to do with "engine won't crank". Stop looking there.

 

2. Maybe VATS. Maybe not. Try the other key for a few days--see what happens (or what doesn't happen...)

 

3. Bad bar on the starter armature. Corroded or otherwise defective connection (low voltage/low amperage) in the starter solenoid power supply including ignition switch. Defective starter solenoid. Defective or out-of-adjustment neutral safety switch.

 

 

"I" would want to know if there's full power to the solenoid "S" terminal when the engine fails to crank. If there's full power, problem is starter/solenoid, or the bigass battery cables/battery cable connections. If there's low power, problem is corrosion/poor connections on the small-gauge wiring . If there's NO power, problem is VATS, defective ignition switch, neutral safety switch adjustment, or a truly screwed-up wire harness.

Edited December 2, 2011 by Schurkey