WHERE to BUY NEW PARTS

[Greazzer]

I am looking into buying a REMAN Engine, Trans, Steering, and picking up ball joints, et cet. Any good vendors out there? My budget for a new drivetrain, steering, and ball joints is around $4,000.00. I plan on doing all the work myself. Is $4,000 unrealistic ? I just RR the waterpump and thermostat and I hope the car will make it until next spring before the major transplant. Trying to breath new life into a very good car. It served us well for the last 10+ years and over 200K miles. We decided to keep it and sell the Acura. Keeping the 2001 Olds Intrige GLS.

 

BTW -- can I somehow get rid of the noisy jet engine-like air pump and the 2 vacuum 2ndardy valves? I guess I would need to replace the ECU?

 

Thanks again, guys. Mark Columbia, SC.

[Cutlass350]

I am looking into buying a REMAN Engine, Trans, Steering, and picking up ball joints, et cet. Any good vendors out there? My budget for a new drivetrain, steering, and ball joints is around $4,000.00. I plan on doing all the work myself. Is $4,000 unrealistic ? I just RR the waterpump and thermostat and I hope the car will make it until next spring before the major transplant. Trying to breath new life into a very good car. It served us well for the last 10+ years and over 200K miles. We decided to keep it and sell the Acura. Keeping the 2001 Olds Intrige GLS. BTW -- can I somehow get rid of the noisy jet engine-like air pump and the 2 vacuum 2ndardy valves? I guess I would need to replace the ECU? Thanks again, guys. Mark Columbia, SC.

IMHO, I would buy a Camry sight unseen from ebay before I bought a REMAN engine for the Intrigue.

IMHO, that's like buying a REMAN engine for a pre-96 Quad4. Gee Punk, do you feel LUCKY?

 

BOTH of those engines have the classic GM SUCKS AT ALUM BLOCK AND HEADS problem. The block and heads are under-designed for COST reasons. So, it's a question of WHEN the block/heads squirm too much to blow head gaskets, ruin heads, block, block internals, etc.

 

Sorry, regardless of the the price of a rebuild, you're still buying JUNK!!

 

Thankfully, for the Intrigue, you can buy a 100% NEW GM LONG BLOCK for ~$2,100 dropped off at your house!

That's cheaper than getting the heads properly redone!

http://paceperformance.com/i-6484855-12458123-3-5llx5-hdohc-1999-2000-olds-intrigue-with-federal-emissionsnf2.html

 

Also, get a NEW GM transmission. Again, GM is practically GIVING THE NEW Intrigue TRANSMISSIONS AWAY!

GM had/has a lot of these 10+ year old engines/trannys sitting around, taking up space and not bringing in money.

 

I can't stress enough that the price for the NEW engine and tranny is CHEAPER than rebuilt!!!

 

Also, see Pace Performance for 100% new GM trannies for your car.

FWIW, Pace was great to deal with (I talked to them on the phone for the order), shipped fast, great shipping container, etc!!

Edited September 9, 2011 by Cutlass350

[Cutlass350]

Steering, and picking up ball joints, et cet. Any good vendors out there? My budget for a new drivetrain, steering, and ball joints is around $4,000.00.

$4K gets tight with a new tranny.

I have my parts list. I'll post it during the weekend.

FWIW: Cardone rebuilt steering racks are another ****ed up gamble. The steering racks wear internally on the soft alum body. So, "rebuilding" is often a joke where they put in new seals, and they might work and last ~$30K miles until they start to leak again. But, being on SC, you have milder winters, and that's when the seal bypass is the most noticeable in racks.

 

I went with the ATSCO Part # 64137 rack.

 

I got most of my stuff at RockAuto http://www.rockauto.com . I didn't get my hubs from them because they had "moog/may be National branded" hubs for the Intrigue. So, I bought Timken hubs from someplace else.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Cutlass350

[Cutlass350]

BTW, Here are pics of the new LX5 longblock that I got from Pace in its shipping packing:

NOTE: It came on that big wide pallet. And, that pallet is too wide for the legs of the engine hoist to go around!

 

 

 

Edited September 9, 2011 by Cutlass350

[Andrew]

The block and heads are under-designed for COST reasons.

how on earth can you believe this? this was a premium engine with very tight tolerances. Im confused, as you say the engine is junk, then go on to say go buy a new one!!

furthermore, i prefer a rebuilt trans, as alot of times the aftermarket parts are superior to OEM.

 

i like http://www.rockauto.com for parts i can wait for.

[Greazzer]

You MUST have a crystal ball. On WED 9-7-11, my wife drove home in a BRAND NEW 2011 CAMRY. This is a riot !!!!!!!!!! This is because the Old's overheated, then overheated, and then overheated again. New water pump. Ran FINE for about 1 day. HOT. New Thermostat and housing. Ran FINE for about 1 day. HOT. Now, its off and on HOT. What is up with that. BTW -- WIFE loves the Camry as well.

[Greazzer]

Joe,

 

Do you think it is possible or realistic to buy NEW GM for $4,000 - $4,500. That is my budget, which is based upon selling a 1993 Acura Legend. I would rather have all NEW drivetrain, et cet. The present drivetrain got us almost 220K miles until everthing started nickle and diming us a few months ago. Your thoughts ? I plan on getting a sub-frame at the junkyard ($25) and rebuilding from there, taking my time, then just popping it in one weekend. Again thanks. Mark

[BXX]

You MUST have a crystal ball. On WED 9-7-11, my wife drove home in a BRAND NEW 2011 CAMRY. This is a riot !!!!!!!!!! This is because the Old's overheated, then overheated, and then overheated again. New water pump. Ran FINE for about 1 day. HOT. New Thermostat and housing. Ran FINE for about 1 day. HOT. Now, its off and on HOT. What is up with that. BTW -- WIFE loves the Camry as well.

 

Partially restricted radiators are good for causing overheating issues.

[mra32]

Soooo the Olds is gone? I kinda enjoy laughing at you two feeding off each other but something in the back of my head is telling me that Cutlass350 is gonna get you duped into spending more money on your car than you need to/can afford. I would just wait for a second opinion, this guy seems biased and doesnt back it up with alot of information. I dont have any experience with the LX5 but if someone told me the best solution was to throw unneccesary parts at my 2000 Intrigue to the tune of a cool $4k (this doesnt include all the little extra things that would "nickel and dime" your engine swap) I would tell them to get right the fuck out of town.

 

As BXX alluded to, a new engine probably wouldnt have totally solved your issues. Jumping to conclusions sometimes costs you a boatload of money

[Greazzer]

Hey ..

 

My "budget" stems from the anticipatory sale of a 1993 Acura Legend. I am making out pretty good if the book value holds steady. My thoughts on the Oldsmobile is that the car is in excellent condition EXCEPT the drivetrain, et cet is tired. That's all. The Olds is absolutely loaded. I can drive the car now without any issue EXCEPT the temp spikes now and then. Taking a look at my prior posts, I totally wimped out because I was going to drop the sub-frame to do bunch a things and the space is tight and I have learned thru the years that making room is many times a lot easier in the long run. However, I just did the water pump and thermostat. Not too bad.... slightly over $100.00 and about 3 hours or so. My thoughts were replacing the drivetrain would equal 200K miles more. Is this really that flawed of an idea. The "shortstar" engine got a lot of very high marks. Until the last few months, the car never really gave us any problems.

[mra32]

The only reason I would (and for that matter, heard of anyone else doing so) replace an engine is if its completely fubared or they want more power or just something different. A stock replacement for an engine that works save for the occasional cooling issue seems like a waste of money to me. I went through some cooling system troubles that lasted me about 2 years off and on and they can be worrisome, but I can assure you, that replacing the engine was not the solution.

 

The only reason I would even consider replacing an engine is if a compression test yielded unfavorable results, the bottom end was screwed, or a leakdown test showed bad results

 

Did you flush the cooling system when you replaced those parts?

 

 

The truth is, with proper maintenance the engine should last as long as you need it. Hopefully your overheating didnt do any damage, but as I spoke of before, there are quick and easy (and cheap to boot) ways to test for that.

 

 

Did a quick check for KBB value for you car being rather optimistic and it wasnt even $3K in my area. YMMV, but I thought it was fairly apt. If it was in super nice condition I could see paying more, but that $3k was for excellent condition.

[Greazzer]

I guess I am being overly pessimistic. My guess is that the engine is on its last leg. BUT, who knows? I could do a compression check and re-flush the system just to make sure. Any other ideas why there is an over heating problem ? If its not the water pump, not the thermostat, not the coolant, its bled, then what else is there ? Radiator ? Running out of issues. But, I will hang tight until there is a catostrphic failure, but then I will have about a month of down time waiting for parts, et cet. From all the critisms on the forum about this engine, I am surprised that mine lasted 220K miles.

[Cutlass350]

how on earth can you believe this? this was a premium engine with very tight tolerances. Im confused, as you say the engine is junk, then go on to say go buy a new one!!

furthermore, i prefer a rebuilt trans, as alot of times the aftermarket parts are superior to OEM.

 

i like www.rockauto.com for parts i can wait for.

 

Not "believe", it's fact.

IMHO, any engine that has a verifiable history of blowing head gaskets within 150K or 15 years means that, like the very well documented *****ed job that GM did on the Quad4 heads and screwing their customers, the heads/block/fastening system is under-designed.

 

I often say that I had a Mastodon as a pet, but only after the species came into existence. There are times it seems like I've been a Principal Engineer that long. My minor is in Mechanical Engineering. (My major is Computer Engineering.) I do a lot of hardware/cpu/computer control of mechanical stuff. I have my MS and work for an FFRDC.

 

Also, I have a work-at-home mainly weekends only contract with a commercial company. I've been very involved with commercial products, since, well Mastodons walked the Earth. ;-) I've done a lot of product specification, product forecasting, etc.

 

The plain fact is any product/part, especially for a commercial company, there are many many many trade-offs. An American engineer typically earns over six figures a year. For very hot software areas (like Android now), an engineer that can define.handle trade-offs (yes, even in software) contracts out for over $250K/year.

 

Yes, IMHO, that is crazy. But, one point is that it's not trivial or easy to determine trade-offs and do a very good/great job. Many Grade School kids can program Android apps! But, there's no *******ing way one would have the knowledge and experience to do an app like the ones that many TV News stations have, and have the app easily maintainable and extendable.

 

 

So.... back to one of my major grips with GM, since the 70's, they've been more short-term profit oriented. The Olds Quad4 engine is a great example. IMHO, that's, by far, one of the best overall engine designs ever!

 

But.... GM is more near-term profit oriented. So, the skimped on the Alum in the heads, the head bolts, the number of bolts/holes, etc. So, the result is that the SOHC version had a tendency to blow head gaskets ~50K miles, the DOHC every ~75K miles. It took GM ~10 years before they finally upgraded the head and fastening design. By then, the fact that the "Quad4 engine" was a massive pile of smoking ****** was know by just about every person on this planet. And, the competition dealers loved that fact. But the '96+ design with the proper (more costly design) was far too late to kill the very infamous pile of smoking ***** that was known as the Quad4 engine.

 

IMHO, even today with the very advanced engine controls and manufacturing, I still LOVE my Quad4 as a real-life daily driver engine more than any other engine I've driven or been in. Yea, Corvettes, Porches, and my Mustang have plenty of power. But, for real-life commuting driving in a big Urban traffic, the engine power is a waste.

 

And, today, many of the engines are very peaky towards the high RPM range, and have poor/horrible low-end torque.

 

Yea, the LX5 and longstar engines are nice. But, IMHO, their torque curve and design are suited more for sales figures (max HP!) than real-life driving. And, yes, that includes the Camry!

 

 

I make no false claims that my Quad4 engines have great reliability. Nor, that the Achieva doesn't have a lot of cost-based problems (leaks between panels being a major one!). But, I LOVE the way my Achieva drive and handle as a commuter car. To me, it's the near perfect match of comfort, handling, power, gas mileage (~30mpg!), etc. But, never ever expect that *I* am going to tell people that an Achieva or Quad4 are reliability - they are far from it compared to other similar cars.

 

 

I see all products as having faults and good points. In other words, I'm an Engineer.

In forums, I consider why someone wants to do something. My '86 Mustang is my play car - pure and simple. Many Fox (pre '94) Mustangs are the same way. But, mu Mustang is also my daily driver in the Summer (unless it rains). That's true for a number of people. So, that directly effects how I setup my Mustang and what mods I do.

 

 

The point is that the orig poster is looking for a reliable daily driver car!

So, my comments are geared towards that goal - not a goal like some student that got the car for free, and wants a car to hopefully last them through 4 years of college.

 

 

Last, before people call me a GM basher, they can ****** off. How many GM cars do "you" own now? How many in the past? How many non GM cars have "you" owned? Unless someone wants to try to take on my history, they should reconsider before they call me a GM basher. I tell the good/bad points. Often, I find it useless to go on and on about how much I LOVE something about a car. I know people aren't going to buy Achievas. Fine, *I* like them. In fact, I've spend over $4k in the past 12 months on my '92 that has a rusting sub-frame that may last only ~5 years. I did look at other cars (new and used - ALL models from ALL manufactures). Sorry, to me, ~$4K and maybe ~$1K/year in repairs still makes my Achieva MY choice. Even if it means that I'm looking at me doing a second engine rebuild (I did the 1st over 10 years ago) before the sub-frame finally rusts too bad. BTW: For my Achieva, I have a replacement rear axle and front sub-frames that I sand-blasted and then Paint-On-Rust coated. Yea, both of those are also known problems with the pre-94 "N" cars.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Cutlass350

[Cutlass350]

Do you think it is possible or realistic to buy NEW GM for $4,000 - $4,500. That is my budget,

 

Check out the Pace Performance website. The thing is that I couldn't find the differences between the 2000 LX5 and 2001. But, From the link that I posted before from the person that did the '99 replacement, it seems that the '99 did not have the EGR ports in the heads, like the 2000+ LX5 engines have. So, I wonder about the listing of the engine as a "99 and 00" replacement. I wonder if it's really more of an "00" and "01" replacement? Still, for a '99, it means "just making and adding block off plates for those EGR ports on the sides of the heads".

 

Maybe Olds did a mid-year change in EGR/head design for the '99 model year. That type of stuff happens more than people realize. The reason? Profit/cost! If there's a non-trivial supply of the previous design left over, and the cost is high (like with the LX5 engine), it makes a lot of sense from a profit point of view to do the change over after the old parts run out.

 

There are many things like that involved in running a real life company that has to deal with real life profits to pay real life employees and appease real life stock holders.

 

I think that you mentioned that you have an air pump? I don't think that I have one. Right now, I don't "remember" taking one off.

If you want to do more research yourself, one place to start (with a good printer and marker ) is

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/productSearch.aspx

 

They have the diagrams on line. You can see if you can find the differences between the 2000 and 2001 engines. Also, it makes for a great disassembly and assembly guide! I have the GM hard copy assembly manuals my '92 Achieva. But, in the 90's, GM and Ford went heavily into electronic distribution of many of the specialty manuals.

 

I'm not sure of the following link will fully work. but here's an example page:

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/productSearch.aspx?&ukey_make=1029&ukey_model=0&ukey_driveline=0&ukey_trimlevel=0&ukey_modelRange=0&modelYear=&ukey_category=0&isOnSale=0&searchTerm=LX5

 

 

 

Also, things like replacing the rack really start to add up! It's ~$300-$400 for the rack, and you also need (should get!) new tie-rod ends. Plus, don't forget the ~$100 alignment needed afterwards.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Cutlass350

[Cutlass350]

Any other ideas why there is an over heating problem ?

If it's overheating, than IMHO, the engine may be worthless.

 

Assuming that no coolant leak is found, there's a very high chance that the head gasket has "gone". In reality, a small leak develops between the cylinder and coolant passage in the head gasket. The reason, as I said before, is because the heads, block, and fastening are under-designed. So, there's far too much squirm/movement between the heads and block. It's not easy, or cheap, to have a well designed all alum block and head. That's why the good ol' cast iron block and head design was used for so long - and is still used in some cases!

 

And, yes, I know that first hand because I was told by both my dealer and local garage that it makes very little financial sense to do a proper head job on these engines. That involves taking off both heads, having then shaved, rebuilt, and Magnafluxed, etc. And, if there's no problem at all with the heads and block, you're coming out paying ~$3K-$4K, and you still have the rest of the engine with over 100K miles, and all of the known long term issues (over 100K) that go with the LX5 engine. If one or both heads need to be replaced (not too uncommon) at ~$1.5K+ for just one head, it gets to the point where a rebuilt (or NEW while GM still has the stock!) makes more financial sense.

 

You need to take the car to a competent DEALER and have them scan/check for a blown head gasket. The LX5/longstar engines "should never ever overheat". LMAO!

 

The engine computer will cycle the firing/non-firing of the cylinders to prevent the engine from overheating. Yes, you can take a good LX5/longstar engine, with zero coolant and no radiator, in the desert, turn the AC on high and drive with "no problem" other than having reduced engine power.

 

By turning off the firing of a cylinder (and the fuel), air is pumped in/out of the cylinder and cools it. Being an all aluminum design, the engine and heads have good heat transfer. So, with some neato control theory (to be careful of the catalytic convertor, balance, etc), the engines are capable of running with no coolant at all. VERY NEAT!

 

Now, back to reality: Again, another GREAT GM engine design! But, again, GM skimped on the head design. ARGG! GM either doesn't learn, doesn't care, or cares more about short-term profits. Gee, guess which one is the most likely.

 

 

To be fair to the design engineers, I feel for them. I know very well the position they are put in.

I have to deal with the same thing on my commercial consulting gigs. IMHO, that's one reason I think that many/most electrical, computer, mechanical engineers leave the field after ~10 years. My mom was a manager for a local Pharmacy. I worked there while in high-school and when I was an undergrad. I learned a lot about stock, profits, customer perception, etc. So, I had very little disillusionment about engineering and commercial products when I graduated from school.

 

And, the execs are also under pressure from various sources. So, it's easy to blame a company for "being too cheap" on a design/product. But, it's far from easy to get the right mix of cost/reliability/quailty/profit to keep the company running/etc.

 

 

BTW: Again, you need a DEALER to do the check! Your local garage does not have the right equipment or ability. A large part of that is due to manufactures no longer allowing full access to engine/tranny/etc computer data. There have been many lawsuits, and bills ("laws") have been proposed, etc. Check out "right to repair" on Google.

 

I have mixed feelings. They tend more towards the consumer. But, I also know that it's not "free or cheap" for the companies to make all of the specialty information (and it's meaning!) to the scanner companies, etc.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Cutlass350

[mra32]

TL;DR

 

but you dont sound like any engineer I've ever met. Suggesting an identical replacement before there is even enough data to characterize the issue is one of the most foolish things someone who calls themselves an engineer can do. Sounds like your verbose self-qualification seeks to distract from the issue that you dont have the decision-making skill-set possesed by any quality engineer.

[Greazzer]

OK --

 

Just had the pro's do a pressure check and whatever other checks to see if it had blown a head gasket, and the answer is NO !. I am very lucky because it did "overheat" -- got up to the redline. So, having that, what else could it be ? Is there a real difference in aftermarket and OEM water pumps? I've notice that it ONLY starts to creep up when sitting in traffic. So, the mechanically driven waterpump is running a lot more at higher RPMs. Could an aftermarket waterpump at idel not push enough coolent. Never did that before, but I just removed the factory waterpump after 219K miles. I am going to clean it up this weekend, and make a list of "fixes" needed. Most of them are cosmetics or easy, e.g., bulbs, touch up paint et cet. Going to detail it because it is a sharp looking car, no matter what any person says. Fully loaded GM, all leather, all options, chrome rims, et cet. Just overheats sitting in traffic, losses a little oil but that is most likely my valve cover gaskets, only gets about 23 mpg, but it still runs smooth as the day we got it in 2001. So, GM didn't make this one so crappy afterall. 2001 Old's Intrigue GLS. Any ideas out there? Thanks again.

[mra32]

If it only creeps up in traffic, it could be your fans. The fans really only need to kick on when in traffic since air isnt being pushed through the radiator simply by the motion of the car. Check to see if the fan turns on when it should. I know that with OBD1 when you put the car into diagnostic mode the fans would turn on. You have OBD2 and I'm not sure the quick and easy way to check the fan operation.

 

You could start it in your driveway, let it idle and the fan should kick on eventually. You can open the hood to see if its trying to cool the car down when the temperature creeps up. If the fan doesnt turn on, it could be the fan itself or the wiring. If you are getting voltage across the terminals for the fan connector when it should be on, but the fan isnt turning, then your fan would be bad. If you arent getting any voltage across the connector, check the fuses and relays first. A bad fan could take out the fuses when it draws too much current to try to turn on. I also think turning on the air conditioning should turn on at least 1 fan automatically.

[Euro]

So many uses of caps lock and bold face:mad: