Oilpatch197 Posted June 18, 2011 Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 (edited) 1992 Buick Regal GS, 3.8 V6 It was after a rain and I had the AC on driving around town. I got a NO RUN condition, as I was driving out of town and over the rail road tracks the car DIED. I am getting fuel pressure, I pulled off a spark plug wire and see if it would jump a spark, nada, NO SPARK. So I'm going to be doing some diagnostics on this car tomorrow morning, can I get some tips on what could have failed? No coils are sparking, so I seriously doubt it's the coils, so while I do the diagnostics, what components on this vehicle are known to go bad? All I see that can go bad is the Crankshaft sensor(I got a dual hall effect-two wires) or the Module the coils plug into. I ran the codes, all I am getting is code "12" for system pass. From what I have read on the internetz, the Control modules on these are prone to go bad. I'll be probing wires tomorrow morning to check voltages. Can Autozone test my ignition control module? Edited June 18, 2011 by Oilpatch197 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoobyDoo82 Posted June 18, 2011 Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 Although I've never had an ICM completely crap out on me (I've had them stop firing a coil or 2) I'd take yours to autozone and have it tested. Not all locations (at least around me) can test them but they can refer you to one that does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oilpatch197 Posted June 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 (edited) Okay thanks, btw I was looking at Crankshaft sensors, and NOTICED that autozone has a stand alone bracket(with no sensor!) does this mean I can replace the crankshaft sensor alone, without messing with the bracket? It would be great to replace it WITHOUT removing the crankshaft damper! Edited June 18, 2011 by Oilpatch197 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 18, 2011 Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 Balancer must be removed. They sell the bracket just in case it gets ruined. While you're in there (if you do it) replace the balancer. It's cheap and fails quite often in the older 3800 cars. Mine did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oilpatch197 Posted June 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 Reading this thread: http://www.gtxf.net/showthread.php?t=20934 So if I check my plugs and they have fuel, that means my crank sensor is good? I'll crank a little and pull a spark plug and see if it's got wet, that should rule out the cranks sensor? But I'll get the ICM tested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted to eaton Posted June 18, 2011 Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 My money is on ICM... When mine went out. it would crank and crank and crank but no spark when i was cranking for 10-15 sec. while giving it gas and i would let out it would back fire lol.. LOUD> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oilpatch197 Posted June 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 ICM tested GOOD at autozone. Now I need to do some probing. 1. check the primary wire (IGN-MOD) wire that is Pink with black stripe at ICM connector. 2. check for voltage at crankshaft sensor, White/Blk wire (10v) 3. check crankshaft sensor signal by slowly turning crank and check modulation/voltage, should be around a 5-12 volt signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 18, 2011 Report Share Posted June 18, 2011 Don't trust the machines at autozone. They commonly say that the ICM is good because all it does is check the internal circuits. There's no way to test it while it's being asked to bear with engine heat and load. Just get a new one and throw it on, just keep it really clean. If it starts you're good, if not clean it up nice and return it, make sure and don't tell them it's been installed. Or if there's a JY around you go grab a couple used ones. My yard charges $10 bucks a pop. Figure one out of the three you grab will be good enough for testing purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oilpatch197 Posted June 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2011 (edited) Well I shall let the pictures tell the story..... ...and the culprit is cord from the serpentine belt. My car eats serpentine belts(it's been 40k miles on this new belt and it's shredding and cracking.) so I got a bent pulley or something? (when I bought the car the alternator shaft was bent, I will double check but perhaps I got a bent pulley that is causing an alignment issue.) I would like to replace the harmonic balancer, I'm going to attempt a repair, as I need this car for work on Monday!!!! Any suggestions on how to carefully bend the teeth back? Also can I use the position of the old crankshaft sensor(by making a mark) to align the new sensor using the old bracket? Edited June 19, 2011 by Oilpatch197 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted to eaton Posted June 19, 2011 Report Share Posted June 19, 2011 Heat and bend back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 The balancer is like $100 new, I would throw a new one on. You could bend it back, but if its not pretty much dead on, you'll get a weak or erratic CPS signal or no signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Right. Plus those "cracks", well that's where they fail. Just replace it you'll be glad you did Oh and replace the CKP sensor too, doesn't make sense not to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oilpatch197 Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 (edited) Well I fixed the Harmonic balancer with a hammer and EASY taps on the sides of the tangs to preserve the arc, and the middle ring had some warpage as well, very easy with the hammer and pin punch. I've done sheet metal body work and having so many machinist in my family.... I was familar with working with metal. I mic'ed it out, I got all the teeth within .010 of an inch run out. (the new sensor spec a .030" gap) and I used the old sensor on the bracket as a reference for the new sensor position on the new bracket, put everything back together and works great... Now after a CAREFULLY watching the pulleys it looks like I got a bent Water pump pulley and my Idler has a groove worn in it. $40 to replace both, and hopefully this will stop excessive belt wear. PET PEEVE RANT ON! What took the longest amount of time was finding ONE FRIGGING BOLT for my puller! The pulley I have uses a M7x 1mm pitch bolts, TRY FINDING ONE ON A SATURDAY AFTERNOON!!!! The puller kit I have has many different bolts, it only provided TWO of the bolts I needed... yeah they cheapened the kit, seriously! So I was pissed, the kit I had only had two of those bolts(what were they thinking!) so I was like "buy or rent a puller", RIGHT? WRONG, every place I went they had those pullers with the larger bolts, for like a Chevy 350 or similar. I_could_not_believe_it....... Sears, Rural King Hardware, O'Rielliy's(I always fock up that spelling), Autozone, nada, no SORRY! NAPA not open(weekend) So I Got pissed! Like DUDES how many 3800's are out there! OMG WTF!!! DUDES I'M SHUT DOWN BECAUSE OF THIS ONE STUPID BOLT. I got desperate and started the dig though my bolt collection and removed a bolt off the intake of another 3800, and it was about the right length, but the threads only went in about 3/16's of an inch then they got hard to turn, I was like FOCK IT, and got my harmonic balancer off. It's the bolt in the picture above with all the washers on it. That one bolt cost me many hours of my weekend!!! Edited June 20, 2011 by Oilpatch197 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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