Factory cheap alternator upgrade

[ManicMechanic]

1990-96 Chevy Lumina APV; Pontiac Trans Sport; Oldsmobile Silhouette

 

1997-09 Chevy Venture/Uplander; Oldsmobile Silhouette; Pontiac Trans Sport/Montana; Saturn Relay and Buick Terraza...Among others.

[GaPrix]

ah okay, u-body that makes sense now. Thanks.

[white4d96]

EDIT: Never mind, apparently they no longer exist.

Edited June 10, 2011 by white4d96

[ManicMechanic]

Actually U vans do still exist...They are still sold in Mexico.

[white4d96]

Also forgot, if you have voltage issues, look into it before throwing money at a bigger alt:

 

If you have sharp drops in voltage, but it bounces back quickly, you need bigger/more batteries. (TYPICALLY)

 

If your voltage drops steadily from sustained play, you need more alt power.

Don't forget to do your big 3 (5 on our cars?) and your power wires in the biggest wire you can. All that power means jack if it can't get anywhere. I know my alt run stock was only 8 gauge, just adding a run of 4 gauge to it and beefing up some grounds caused a 1.3 volt increase in charging voltage.

[alec_b]

I know just doing the big ONE (alt. to batt.) in my '91 regal made a difference. Not a really big one of course, but running an additional 0 ga wire from the alternator to the battery helped stabilize my voltage at regular volumes.

 

However, cruising at 70 MPH and turning up the subs would easily pull the volt gauge into the red. That was a stock 105A alt.

[AWeb80]

interesting thrad. I just had mine rebuilt for the second time and upped the stator to 140 amp. The previous rebuild lasted longer in years and mileage with 3 amps on it than the stock alt with nothing on it.

[Garrett Powered]

I know just doing the big ONE (alt. to batt.) in my '91 regal made a difference. Not a really big one of course, but running an additional 0 ga wire from the alternator to the battery helped stabilize my voltage at regular volumes.

 

However, cruising at 70 MPH and turning up the subs would easily pull the volt gauge into the red. That was a stock 105A alt.

 

 

the big "1" does not increase your voltage alone though, not without doing the "key" wire as I call it. one of the big 5 on w-body cars. the key wire is the block-to-body wire that ALL power consumed by the running vehicle (besides the battery ground) all power produced by the alt (again besides charging the battery) ground through.

 

if you do not drain the battery you do not have to charge it though so other grounds are not considered "key" ground wires.

 

I would consider it being 1 great upgrade, but stability of the regulator can be increased further with addition of a cushioning capacitor and a huge "key" wire.

[xtremerevolution]

the big "1" does not increase your voltage alone though, not without doing the "key" wire as I call it. one of the big 5 on w-body cars. the key wire is the block-to-body wire that ALL power consumed by the running vehicle (besides the battery ground) all power produced by the alt (again besides charging the battery) ground through.

 

if you do not drain the battery you do not have to charge it though so other grounds are not considered "key" ground wires.

 

I would consider it being 1 great upgrade, but stability of the regulator can be increased further with addition of a cushioning capacitor and a huge "key" wire.

 

One thing that you are right about is that the ground wire in question is most likely the most important wire. The alternator wire is sized according to the alternator's peak output. Increasing that wire size doesn't do a whole lot considering its already designed to take what the stock alternator can deliver at peak. Not that I wouldn't recommend upgrading it...

[white4d96]

Idk, I had an increase in voltage with just the big "1" as some call it. A run of 4 gauge upped my voltage by .4. I doubled that with the batt-chassis ground. I still need to do my engine ground, but my front batt is going byebye so I won't be worrying about aux post to batt.

[Garrett Powered]

Idk, I had an increase in voltage with just the big "1" as some call it. A run of 4 gauge upped my voltage by .4. I doubled that with the batt-chassis ground. I still need to do my engine ground, but my front batt is going byebye so I won't be worrying about aux post to batt.

 

Oh, you have not done the key wire? unlock your alternator's potential with a highly defined ground path for all electronics to enjoy!!!

[jman093]

Has anyone actually tried to fit these? CS144's are quite a bit larger than CS130D's. It's actually pretty close in size to the AD244 (which I think also uses the same 2 bolt mounting and are more reliable than the CS series). CS130D vs CS144

 

[GaPrix]

I went to j/y looking at these just to get an idea, I was actually going to pull one of the u-van alts and put it in a gp just to see, sadly though out of 8 vans only 2 had alts but that were caked in oil/grime, I didnt feel like it. Maybe I'm missing something are the connectors different to alts? or the same, I had assumed larger alt different connector/harness/whatever they're called.

[AWeb80]

I'm going to expand on my above post. Why not just get a quality rebuild. My stock factory alt made it ~60k miles from 1994 to 1999. I had it rebuild to the stock amps and it made it from 60k miles to 130k miles from 1999-2010.....and this was all on 2 12' subs, 1000watt amp, and 2 more amps running my 6x9's and 5.25's. I just had it rebuild and had them up the amps to 140 (would have gone 160 but they didn't have the parts on hand). I've never had a problem w/ my lights flickering when bumping hard.

 

A basic rebuild at my local shop costs ~$95, to up the amps it cost me $135 and I KNOW it will last a long time just as the previous rebuild did. The local shop is known for quality work and awesome service.

 

so, why not find a reputable repair place instead of spending bookoo bucks on shit.

[jman093]

I'm going to expand on my above post. Why not just get a quality rebuild. My stock factory alt made it ~60k miles from 1994 to 1999. I had it rebuild to the stock amps and it made it from 60k miles to 130k miles from 1999-2010.....and this was all on 2 12' subs, 1000watt amp, and 2 more amps running my 6x9's and 5.25's. I just had it rebuild and had them up the amps to 140 (would have gone 160 but they didn't have the parts on hand). I've never had a problem w/ my lights flickering when bumping hard.

 

A basic rebuild at my local shop costs ~$95, to up the amps it cost me $135 and I KNOW it will last a long time just as the previous rebuild did. The local shop is known for quality work and awesome service.

 

so, why not find a reputable repair place instead of spending bookoo bucks on shit.

 

I guess I wouldn't really consider having to rebuild it every 60-70k miles good. At all. My car is now going to be on at least it's 3rd rebuild/new alternator after I finally get around to rebuilding this one. (Probably needs a $20 rectifier) The alt on mine right now is a supposed improved and upgraded 160Amp aftermarket one Paul put on there. With a CS130D it's always going to be a matter of time. The cooling on them sucks and upgrading them for more output only aggravates the problem. A CS144 is better (does have bearing issues though) and AD series I've heard are much, much more reliable. It would be nice to replace it and forget about it forever. Especially if you own an LQ1.

[Galaxie500XL]

I've been driving for over 30 years now, and pretty much any alternator I had that went farther than about 40k was an unusual one.

 

Could be worse...the old Galaxie I had used a generator, and I had to replace the brushes in it about every 20k...the generator burned itself up at 140k...

 

I guess I wouldn't really consider having to rebuild it every 60-70k miles good. At all. My car is now going to be on at least it's 3rd rebuild/new alternator after I finally get around to rebuilding this one. (Probably needs a $20 rectifier) The alt on mine right now is a supposed improved and upgraded 160Amp aftermarket one Paul put on there. With a CS130D it's always going to be a matter of time. The cooling on them sucks and upgrading them for more output only aggravates the problem. A CS144 is better (does have bearing issues though) and AD series I've heard are much, much more reliable. It would be nice to replace it and forget about it forever. Especially if you own an LQ1.

[Garrett Powered]

I got a cs144 on my 88 and they are good, but nowhere as good at cooling off as a cs130d, not even close.

 

they are basically a bigger cs130 which is why the bearings fail more often.

 

what makes you think it will cool off better? considering the main contributor to overheating is resistance, it would lead me to believe that it takes longer to heat up that bigger chassis if anything. go try to run a marathon breathing only through a drinking straw and see how quick your lungs overheat. if you have real big strong lungs you might make it an extra mile, but take off the straw and the better shape runner will now win. the cs130d is packed with way more technology and leaner smarter more efficient longer lasting machine. the cs144 is more of a big dumb muscle bound football athlete than a marathon runner. I like mine still, I am not complaining about having GM's finest from 20 years ago, but do not assume the cs130d is bad in any way because I can prove it is not.

[white4d96]

Bad? No. Good enough for, say, someone planning to run 3k? Not a chance.

 

I will likely be running an AD244. That, or caving and ordering a DC 270XP and having 200A idle output

[Garrett Powered]

I would try and run 3k watts with either one of my cs130d's. if it didn't keep up, then I would go with something bigger if I could shoehorn it in there. I think with my dual battery setup and 3.5 farad cap I would be fine though during short bursts. not like you will be running it full blast all day long.

 

I cant remember how this cs144 got fitted to the 3400... I think he used a bracket off a minivan which if someone mentioned that, confirms that. but if the AD244 is the same size, then maybe I will be doing the same thing you are if you get one. I always can use more power and also I might be setup for that already.

 

either way, I love doing stuff like this.

[xtremerevolution]

I'm going to expand on my above post. Why not just get a quality rebuild. My stock factory alt made it ~60k miles from 1994 to 1999. I had it rebuild to the stock amps and it made it from 60k miles to 130k miles from 1999-2010.....and this was all on 2 12' subs, 1000watt amp, and 2 more amps running my 6x9's and 5.25's. I just had it rebuild and had them up the amps to 140 (would have gone 160 but they didn't have the parts on hand). I've never had a problem w/ my lights flickering when bumping hard.

 

A basic rebuild at my local shop costs ~$95, to up the amps it cost me $135 and I KNOW it will last a long time just as the previous rebuild did. The local shop is known for quality work and awesome service.

 

so, why not find a reputable repair place instead of spending bookoo bucks on shit.

 

You can probably get 3 junkyard alternators for the price of a rebuilt alternator.

 

Has anyone actually tried to fit these? CS144's are quite a bit larger than CS130D's. It's actually pretty close in size to the AD244 (which I think also uses the same 2 bolt mounting and are more reliable than the CS series). CS130D vs CS144

 

 

 

Please read the first post.

 

I've been driving for over 30 years now, and pretty much any alternator I had that went farther than about 40k was an unusual one.

 

Could be worse...the old Galaxie I had used a generator, and I had to replace the brushes in it about every 20k...the generator burned itself up at 140k...

 

Funny, I have driven my car for 180k miles now and I've replaced the alternator twice.

[RobertISaar]

the CS130D in the 95MC lasted to ~160,000 miles and was mistakenly diagnosed(battery was ~6 years old) as a problem, replaced with ValuCrap(STUPID IDEA! SPEND THE EXTRA $10 FOR THE DURALAST WITH LIFETIME WARRANTY!), lasted less than 2 years, replaced with junkyard ACDelco, and it lives again beyond 185,000 miles.

[AWeb80]

I could put a jy unit on, but with a rebuilt one, I know it'll last a while without being a question of when.

[RobertISaar]

and while i'm thinking about it: the generator(alt in 1970?) in my dad's 70MC was original until a couple of years ago when we mistakenly replaced that as well(turns out there was a shorted circuit elsewhere).

 

we have good luck with factory stuff around here, not so much with guessing what the problem is when they arise.

[Garrett Powered]

it just depends if you want a stock, or a built one that you can be proud of. there is a catalog at my local shop I go to and you can order all the good stuff and go as wild as you want to. yes this costs money, but you will not regret it if your build is a success. I have a year and $400 into my latest one. not to mention having the thing on and off the car like 5 times. and even more trips (30 minutes each way) to the shop and back.

 

it was a hassle, and money was wasted, and it set me back a lot, and we tested many parts. am I glad I did it???? HELL yeah.

[white4d96]

At that point I would just spend another $100 up front to get one from a reputable company like DCPower or Mechman that's GUARANTEED to put out x amps at idle and y amps max, bench-tested before it gets put in your box (with the results) and will bolt right in.