Myotis1134 Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Waited a month for summit to ship me my new radiator, then took 4 days to figure out how to re-route transmission-coolant lines (old radiator had inlet and outlet on passenger side), finally got everything connected and leak-free (finally). Drove the beast up to Anchorage on Memorial Day, and blew a spark-plug out of the back side head leaving my aunt and uncle's house. Did a 'u' on the highway and parked the bitch in their driveway, where it awaits repair. The existing heads were heli-coiled by me on the number 3 and 5 pistons, when a spark plug replacement went very wrong in 2008. They are holding. The plug that went was the number 1, and there were heli-coil threads still on the plug when it blew out. I didn't mess with that one, which means that the previous owner did. I suppose that in light of how hard I drive the car, everything has held up very well. Regardless, the back head (and probably the front) needs to be replaced. I figure that as long as I'm committed to the head replacement, I might as well see what improvements I can integrate as well. My problem is that I am not knowledgeable in this area, and am having difficulties finding information that I can understand. I am requesting ideas for head improvements (components mostly I imagine), that will make this situation worth the trouble it's caused. The engine is completely stock, a 3.1 sitting in a lumina euro. I have been researching head prices online, and $250-300 seems to be the average cost for a re-build. Jbody performance has a sweet set of heads all decked out for about $2,000, but I'm not into that quite yet. (http://www.jbodyperformance.com/new/PartDetails.php?partId=151&catId=151&catName=JP0151). I plan to get a set of heads from a salvage yard and refurbish them with some decent components, after cleaning them up of course. I am looking for ways to do this cost-effectively, yet have the finished product be an improvement over what was there originally. I appreciate all and any ideas/comments on this, as I really only have a vague idea of what I'm doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 (edited) http://www.domesticcrew.com/hybrid.html i can't remeber what is 100% required on a W, since i think that guide is intended for a 2nd gen J-body. asking on 60V6 may be a good idea. if i had to guess, the ones from JBP look like 2nd gen heads, and for that amount of money, you could have Ben port up some nice gen3 heads and still have tons of cash left over and still be making more power. EDIT: from the sounds of it, they offer the same "package" for both gen2 and gen3, so it sounds like if you tell them you had a 3.1, they would be sending p/p 3.1 heads/cam, but if you told them 3x00, you would get gen3 parts... Edited June 4, 2011 by RobertISaar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myotis1134 Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Thanks for the info and site. The hybrid project is enticing for sure, but since I only need new heads, can I ass-u-me that swapping in '00+ 3X00 heads can be a standalone project? If so then I'm going to do it. The advantages are plain, and even with the need for custom pushrods, the cost should be way less than the jbody performance heads. Crap, it just occurred to me, with different size exhaust ports, that implies the need for different size manifolds. Guess I'm going to be hitting up the junk yard. p.s. Exactly how does one go about inquiring how to get information on having Ben port up some gen 3 heads for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 i don't think it's possible to throw gen2 LIM/upwards on gen3 heads, and even if you could, it would be a total mistake. maybe throttle body, but even that would be a bad idea from a power standpoint. you don't NEED different manifolds, but they are recommended to see the full benefit of the gen3 topend. Ben is an admin on 60degreev6.com and owns WOT-Tech.com. contacting him either way should yield the same results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1QUICKHATCH Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 I have a set of ported Gen II 3.1 heads if your just looking for a simple power upgrade with your re & re? they are milled and have a fresh valve job! also have some Gen III stuff too if your interested! the 3.1 ports do not line up with the 3x00 ports. for the best results you will want 3400 heads, lower intake manifold and a plenum from a 2000+ 3400, 3100, or even a 3500! (note: the 3500 plenum will require a TB adaptor and some modifing to work) as for the top end swap you will need a throttle cable for a 3100 w-car, upper rad hose for a 3100 w-car, your mounts will work fine. I just went right off the heater core with the heater hoses instead of having them loop around to the front of the engine like stock. If you have any mor qustion free to ask and I will try to answer them the best I can! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy K Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 step 1: unplug the injector for the bad cylinder and drive the car home. no fuel to that cylinder = no BBQ for the engine. step 2: It likely would it be easier to just get a complete 3100, 3400, or even 3500 to install... and I'm sure someone can make you a chip... and the 97+ 3x00 rear exhaust manifold p.s. I saw you had passenger side internal radiator trans cooler.... I assume the car is a 3 speed automatic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myotis1134 Posted June 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 (edited) The tranny is a 4T60 with 4 forward gears (are you supposed to count overdrive?). I've been looking around, and it seems that throwing new (ish) heads on an old engine is a good way to loose both, due to compression issues from old rings. Any truth in that? I'm pushing 170,000 miles as it is, and while I plan on doing something about the engine (rebuild or 3800 swap, not sure yet), I don't want to blow it up. In light of what I have found concerning new heads on an old engine, I have been looking into twinserts by helicoil. Anyone heard of them, or where to get them? Apparently it's a double helicoil, which would fix the spark plug thread issue for sure, but so far I haven't been able to find anyone who sells them online. I have emailed thor international, who owns helicoil, but the bloody company is based in Singapore, so I am not counting on a speedy answer to the most important question, which is what size twinsert kit to get. I know spark plug threads are M14 x 1.25, and that takes care of the inner insert, but what size to get for the outer insert. Guess I'll have to buy a standard helicoil kit and experiment. Edited June 7, 2011 by Myotis1134 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Powered Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 I just took one of the scrap motors laying around and built it up. then swap it in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhildebrand Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 I had my heads machined at the local NAPA store. I think it was only $170 to do both of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myotis1134 Posted June 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Decided to go the "cheapest" route. Found an oversized thread repair insert by TimeSert: http://www.mechanicstoolsandbits.com/product_info.php/big-sert-spark-plug-kits-time-sert-big-sert-spark-plug-thread-repair-kit-m14-125-part-5141-5141-p-821 This way I don't have to worry about blowing my engine up with new heads, and it costs a hell of a lot less. The problem I have now run into is figuring out what length of insert to get, my choices are 9.4mm, 11.0mm, 15.0mm, and 16.8mm. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Measure the length of the threads of a spark plug. Get the closest. A little longer probably wont hurt, nor will a little shorter. Closer the better, and I'd say no more than a couple MM's either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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