alec_b Posted June 7, 2010 Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 This isn't really a problem, because the car starts just fine, but after it sits for more than say an hour or so, I get a long crank when I start it. Warm crank is a hit the key and go instantly, cold it spins over 4 or 5 times before it fires. I did notice, though, that if I give it just a little tiny bit of throttle during a cold crank it fires immediately. Should I take the throttle body off and clean the IAC port? Or is it maybe a TPS out of adjustment? I don't think it's adjustable on mine but I guess I never really looked that close. At least it's very consistent so I'll be able to easily see what fixes it when I find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1990lumina Posted June 7, 2010 Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 Try cycling the key on and off a few times before you try and start it. You might just have low fuel pressure of the start from a leaky injector, or a plugged fuel filter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatTheFehl Posted June 7, 2010 Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 Yeah, I'm gonna guess an injector that is on its way out. Sounds similar to the problem we had with the S10 where I used to work, except opposite. It would start instantly on cold days (barely even crank, just like "click. VROOM") and on warm days it would crank and crank and crank and eventually catch, but it would stumble a little until you gave it some gas and it evened out. Warm days after just shutting it off, restarting it was easy though. After replacing the fuel filter, we pretty much decided it was probably a bad injector. We never replaced it in the time that I worked there (it was like this for over a year) and it never failed to start. That thing was incredibly reliable, far more so than the other company vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 I tried the key cycling thing, it's not a fuel pressure issue. That doesn't change anything. I could maybe see a sticking injector, but just as you described 95, that will usually cause a hard warm start, not a hard cold start. Same goes for the FPR, which I confirmed isn't leaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted June 7, 2010 Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 Sounds like the fuel pump relay died or there is a wiring issue from the PCM to the fuel pump.. Causing you to have to crank until you build up enough oil pressure and then the oil pressure sensor/switch will trigger the fuel pump. So you need to verify you are getting the 12v on signal from the PCM (Pin D1) to the fuel pump relay (Pin 5, Dk Grn/Wht wire). Also verify ground of the relay (Pin 2, Blk wire). Start with that. Try swapping relays is the easiest. Note, use a multimeter!! not a test light. You need to make sure your getting a solid 12V from the PCM to the relay. Ive seen them only send out around 5-9V due to PCM/wiring issues which will not trigger the relay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted June 7, 2010 Report Share Posted June 7, 2010 For reference... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 Very good info! I'll definitely check into that as soon as I get some free time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuntzie Posted June 8, 2010 Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 sounds like a weak fp to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 Weak fuel pump? I'd think there'd be other symptoms besides just a cold long crank. Every other fuel pump I've had go bad has shown other signs like decreased fuel economy, loss of power, rough idling, etc. I have none of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuntzie Posted June 8, 2010 Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 my prix ran fine, lots of power, and my fp was fine when driving, fp would take a long time to get up to the 40+ psi though at startupm the fuel pressure would drop after about 5 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtwmechanic Posted June 8, 2010 Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 put a fuel pressure guage on the rail and see how many cycles it takes to get max pressure. if it takes more than 2 or 3 then maybe bad pump or clogged filter or even a relay going out. when all else fails do a continuity test like Bob suggested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted June 9, 2010 Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 I tried the key cycling thing, it's not a fuel pressure issue. That doesn't change anything. As he said, cycling the key woulda allowed it to build up pressure and then would have fired right away. It didnt, so I cant see it being a fuel pressure issue due to a clogged fuel filter or weak pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 Right, the very first thing I tried when I noticed the condition was cycling the key a couple times. Made no difference at all in the amount of time it cranked. The ONLY thing that has made any difference is giving it just a tad bit of throttle while cranking and she catches right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtwmechanic Posted June 9, 2010 Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 (edited) dirty throttle body or a tps going out? any codes stored? have seen cases where this is the sympton o f a bad stuck or dirty iac Edited June 9, 2010 by jtwmechanic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted June 9, 2010 Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 Clean MAF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 No codes stored, but it is OBD1. The SES light has never come on while I've had the car, other than the bulb check (yes, it works). I suppose dirty MAF might do it, possibly not calculating the incoming air correctly. The TPS was my thought, I haven't gotten a chance to look and see if I can actually adjust it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtwmechanic Posted June 9, 2010 Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 don't beleive it is adjustable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alec_b Posted June 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2010 Whoever said fuel pump may have put the kibosh on my car... Twice tonight I've gotta a random stumble, both in the same trip. Once was leaving my apartment, making a u-turn, I got the typical "running out of gas" feeling, but it cleared up immediately. Went to the store, fine. On the way back, waiting at a red light, all of a sudden the car LURCHES forward and the rpm's jump from their usual ~650 at idle to somewhere around 900, which I'm assuming was the PCM trying to keep the car alive. Pretty glad there wasn't anyone in front of me though cause I moved a good 10 feet. I don't hold the brake very hard when I'm sitting still... Anyways right after I pulled away from the light it chugged a bit during the acceleration, again like it was losing fuel, but then it was fine the rest of the trip. This was all in about 2 miles round trip. I'm going to get a new filter on it this weekend, the one on there now doesn't look old but who cares. I'm going to get a pressure gauge on it too, I'll be ROYALLY pissed if I have to put a god damn pump in this thing. I can not take any bullshit from this car right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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