Penglii's 1989 TGP

[Penglii]

Then when I get confused I'll be asking you for help

 

Productive day today actually, a slight kick to the nuts for my wallet, but it's all in the name of progress so I'll live.

Took half a day off this morning... got the Blue GP Sedan re-registered, so I finally have a car I can drive around until I get the TGP sorted out, that alone is a load off my back.... Got a LC-1 w/Gauge ordered from Amazon too. Should be here sometime next week. Woot.

[White93z34]

Man, I thought my car was a bastard to just run right with stock everything. I don't even understand half the jazz talked about in this thread You are a braver man then myself. Sounds like you are making progress though.

[Penglii]

LOL the irony is the car ran like a champ (for the first few weeks) with stock everything... after I replaced the x-over that is...

 

6 months ago I would not have understood half this jazz either... and yet here I am... plunging headlong into the darkness at WOT.

I guess that does take some serious guts.

 

Part of the reason I bought this car was because it would force me to learn how to properly work on a car... and it's sure doing that like a champ!

Edited October 26, 2010 by Penglii

[tornado_735]

LOL the irony is the car ran like a champ with stock everything... after I replaced the x-over that is...

 

6 months ago I would not have understood half this jazz either... and yet here I am... plunging headlong into the darkness at WOT.

I guess that does take some serious guts.

 

Part of the reason I bought this car was because it would force me to learn how to properly work on a car... and it's sure doing that like a champ!

 

I did the same thing when I bought my first Land Rover...DAMN was there a learning curve

[Turbo v-sick]

I'm gonna stop being so hard-headed and admit that you are probably right.

I owe you an apology for my attitude these past couple of days... I'm sorry for that.

No worries man. Over on the TGP forums I am the resident asshole, so I can take it.

[Garrett Powered]

Man, I thought my car was a bastard to just run right with stock everything. I don't even understand half the jazz talked about in this thread You are a braver man then myself. Sounds like you are making progress though.

 

I was just telling Adam on the phone thinking back how it used to be for me, I wouldn't know half of what he was talking about, but now I am not only able to follow along and see/bring up tables in the BIN and stuff, and partially comprehend in conversations like this. I don't know how Penglii is picking up on this so fast with just a scanner, but he is. Robert has seen my reaction after seeing the new version 5. 2010 is the new beginning and my interest in these cars is spiking. if you guys have not been playing with this newly updated version and finding out all the cool new stuff it has yet, you are really going to SHIT YOUR PANTS when you do LOL! I had version 4.1 and looked around for a bit, it was pretty cool. but honestly it bored me to death. I don't know if it was just I didn't know how to dial things in yet or the looks, lack of colorful more useful graphs, harder to use, my own ignorance, more than likely I was just scared of it or just oblivious? I didn't want to pay for the software even, but now I gladly paid the 40 bucks or whatever. after trying it out for free first, of course.

 

these cars are so sophisticated that nothing else is going to be as complete and useful tool for working on them, you need to be able to monitor everything going on in order to get your car running the way it should before you can even tune. and right now there is no better way to see whats really going on than a laptop with XP and tunerpro v5. unless you can go to GMs halifax plant and hook it back up to the "umbilical cord" from which the car was born. It was sophisticated just as much in stock form so you are still brave if you master it. that plant was brand new in 1988 and they got motor trend COTY status because of it. and now Robert has the most complete 8F XDF to date. the best one available.

[Penglii]

I was HUGELY influinced by this book as a child... so much so that when I imagine the inner workings of the TGP I envision little wooly mammoths doing things for me.

 

I CANNOT WAIT to get my hands on TunerPro... it's gonna make things a lot easier now that I've reached the point where it's effectively mandatory for the tuning I need done.

 

I don't know how Penglii is picking up on this so fast with just a scanner, but he is.

 

Lots of research/reading... lots of imagination... and lots of headaches!

Also... Robert has been a big help.

Edited October 26, 2010 by Penglii

[Penglii]

W/B should be delivered tomorrow

 

It also occurs to me that between years of running rich before I changed out the X-over, oil smoke from the old blown turbo, and raw fuel from the bad injectors... my Cat has probably seen better days.

Maybe that is contributing to the nonsensical o2 readings.

 

I suppose I should try to knock some crap out of it before I install the w/b... I assume that's as simple as jacking up the front of the car, unbolting the Cat from the downpipe, letting it drop down (is there enough play in the exhaust hangers for that?), reaming the crap out of it with a metal rod, letting the waste fall into a container, then reassembling?

[Garrett Powered]

you could have the car backpressure tested first to see if its even an issue.

 

or take off all seven bolts and drop off the whole exhaust system so you can weld in a test pipe.

[Penglii]

you could have the car backpressure tested first to see if its even an issue.

 

or take off all seven bolts and drop off the whole exhaust system so you can weld in a test pipe.

 

I don't have to worry about emissions testing or anything, so it might not be so bad to just gut it either way and not have to think about it again. LOL

*shrugs*

[Garrett Powered]

you could rod it out, but I think cutting it out and possibly recycle the cat? also a test pipe might flow a little smoother. hard to say though.

 

I am probably going to order a high flow cat for my new 2.5" exhaust system. even though we don't have emission testing here, it maybe soon we will.

[Penglii]

you could rod it out, but I think cutting it out and possibly recycle the cat? also a test pipe might flow a little smoother. hard to say though

 

Good future plans... but right now I gotta go with what will provide dead simple guaranteed results... the primary focus here is getting a good tune on the engine during idle and part throttle. I don't have the resources to stray too far beyond that right now. Proper exahust work is maybe a project for spring.

[Garrett Powered]

well I tell you what, try Adam's 28lb tune on your car. I just gave it another try and all the sudden my car is running a LOT better. When I first got my chip burner I tried it but wasn't having any luck but since I updated the software version I got it to burn right. I am not sure if that is all it was, but the important thing is now the car really friggin hauls ASS, along with better driveability. the wideband shows up on tunerpro like it should and the rich exhaust smell has all but cleared up. so I can officially say I recommend trying that tune first before jumping to conclusions about the exhaust.... unless you are really sure it's plugged. I had the same concerns and for awhile it was running so rich that fuel would blow up in the muffler, and now one of my mufflers rattles and resonates internally which is super annoying. maybe yours will clear up with the right tune and all that carbon will burn outta there?

 

I have tried a bunch of BIN's though on my car and this one I got in it now is running the best so far. granted I now have a bunch of old demons worked out of the equation, but I am probably for the first time exceeding power levels I was at when I first got this car running good with stock everything and just a topgun 160. it was running sub-par for awhile there after transitioning to the LS1 injectors but now its a different story. I will be dyno-ing the car soon, I can tell you that much.

 

just to give you an update in my car since we both are running close to the same set-up.

[Penglii]

That makes sense... I'll have to give it a try when I get my burner in a few weeks or so.

Can you send me that BIN?

In the meantime I guess I'll continue to cool my heels... all this waiting is the hardest part so far! LOL

 

Also, got any pro-tips for installing the W/B o2? I'll probably be doing that this weekend.

 

EDIT: I guess the BURN2 is on backorder until December... the delays just never end do they?

Edited November 2, 2010 by Penglii

[Garrett Powered]

no the delays are only just beginning. lol.

 

I was hanging on by a thread for like a year. now I am celebrating whats for me the time that it all came together.

 

my big turbo, my custom CS130 D alternator and fully bad ass charging system. good running base tune, and tuning platform. fuel ignition and delivery all perfect. worked out most of the kinks. all that is left is fine tuning stuff and regular maintenance. and stereo system, suspension and other fun stuff I like doing with these cars.

 

I got a crappy how-to in a thread I had for now you could read for some info on the WB. the pin must be installed in the factory harness and it kind of walks you through that.

 

http://www.w-body.com/showthread.php/41817-started-on-exhaust-and-WB02-install-%28vid-pg.3%29/page2

 

as far as the BIN. I can't just give that out without permission. I would have to talk to Adam first. or you could contact him. I am sure if you sent him your MEMCAL he could burn it for you.

[Penglii]

Ahhhh yeah, that makes sense... it *is* his intellectual property after all. I'll ask him about it when I finally get the w/b installed and proper datalogging sorted out.

 

I'll also read that thread and see if I can make heads or tails of what I need to do... I'm sure it will be a good starting point at least.

[Penglii]

HOLY CRAP getting the w/b to communictate via the ECM is a scary-ass looking project! Just getting the LC-1 installed at all is even gonna be a learning experience for me.

Talk about jumping right into the wiring deep end! LOL

I may focus first on getting the LC-1 installed normally with the gauge and the n/b emulation and go from there... unless you can somehow convince me otherwise...

[Garrett Powered]

its cake.

 

do it. go all out and install it so you can datalog and see it in tunerpro 5.

 

getting in the gauge and purple wire hooked up for the NB would be a good start though.

[Penglii]

LOL I like your optimistic confidence

 

I guess I'll see what I end up feeling comfortable doing.

Step 1 of the installation is "buy soldering iron and learn to solder" if that gives you any clues.

I'm a good learner and pretty patient so I'm not worried that there's going to be any epic fail moments... but I'm basically starting from scratch on wiring work with this undertaking.

[Garrett Powered]

I never solder anything. I -am- the crimpmaster! lol.

[Penglii]

LOL I've heard too many horror stories about crimping.

[Garrett Powered]

I have SEEN nightmare crimping aftermath.

 

it's all in the type of crimper you have. also I use special connectors, heat shrink with adhesive liners and grounding compound.

[Penglii]

STATUS REPORT:

I removed my Cruise Control and capped off it's vac lines... that gave me MUCH more room to work.

I located a firewall grommet and fed all the LC-1 wires & serial jacks into the car... also ran a wire to spoof the narrowband with.

I officially HATE HATE HATE the plastic/rubber firewall covering... it slowed me down way too much.

Now I just have all the wiring left to do... I might save most of that for tomrorow.

 

Anybody know which wire, of the many wires under the dash, is a switched 12v wire??

[Garrett Powered]

I never had to cap off the cruise lines...

 

also the only wires I ran through the firewall was for the gauge (for my PLX Devices gauge). when I installed my LC1 I didn't have a gauge though so it was all in the engine bay. you gotta ground the LC1 to the block. well, you don't HAVE to but I did. I used 4 but you could get away with 8 gauge and run it from where the other main grounds bolt on to the block. I found room to fish it up through underneath the washer bottle near the fender. cant even tell its there with the black silicone hood over the gold distribution block.

 

since I had to run the brown wire across the firewall any way, I tapped the injector's switched power wire source kind of like Ken did his on the 88. and bundled the 2 wires in to some loom and over to the washer bottle area. the excess wires for the controller can just be bundled up and zip-tied and just lay on top of the cruise module or something. you will find a good way of doing it without taking away from the beauty of the tgp engine bay.

[Penglii]

Ahhh well I had some vac line caps handy and I was not sure if there would be a vac leak with the CC module removed since I plan on keeping it removed. *shrugs*

 

As for the wiring... that makes sense. I ended up pulling everything through into the cabin basically because... I guess it just made sense at the time. I'm not sure where I'm going to ground it to yet... but I'll figure that out tomorrow when I wire everything together. From reading the manual it made it sound like it was more important to ground everything to the *same* spot than it was to ground to any particular spot.