Stuck lifter?

[alec_b]

Sounds just like mine, I have an identical tick sometimes. It sure sounds like an exhaust leak on mine, possibly a hairline crack in one of the manifolds. Mine doesn't sound anything like a lifter tick, and to be honest I can't hear a lifter in your vid's either.

 

Oh and the OPSU is above the filter on the back of the block. Easiest to access with the passenger side tire removed.

[xtremerevolution]

Sounds just like mine, I have an identical tick sometimes. It sure sounds like an exhaust leak on mine, possibly a hairline crack in one of the manifolds. Mine doesn't sound anything like a lifter tick, and to be honest I can't hear a lifter in your vid's either.

 

Oh and the OPSU is above the filter on the back of the block. Easiest to access with the passenger side tire removed.

 

Funny you mentioned that, because a guy on the Bonneville forum was saying it sounds just like an exhaust tick at the flex pipe between the rear manifold flange and the cat being leaky or rusty. Last time I was under there, I definitely noticed it was a bit old. I'll be damned if that's the only problem.

 

I don't know what a lifter tick sounds like, so I figured those videos would help narrow the problem. That sure saves me a bit of cash. Now to figure out what's causing my idle vibration.

[xtremerevolution]

Someone on the Bonneville forums mentioned the possibility of this being a loose timing chain tensioner.

 

Any ideas? I've never heard of one going bad on a 3800.

[RobertISaar]

Someone on the Bonneville forums mentioned the possibility of this being a loose timing chain tensioner.

 

Any ideas? I've never heard of one going bad on a 3800.

 

they may be "lifelong" chain and tensioners, but that doesn't stop the 3x00 crowd from replacing them when they start getting sloppy...

[xtremerevolution]

Well I went out again to a high school parking lot and revved my engine for 15 minutes. I put my head as close to the timing cover as I could, and the noise only got quieter. It did get louder as I put my head closer to the exhaust manifold.

 

Is there a possibility that the noise is coming from a bad spark plug wire or spark plug arcing? That would also explain the rough idle, and the sound sure does sound extremely similar.

 

Also, you can hear the engine exhaust noise pretty loud from inside the car toward the front, so I'm going to replace that flex pipe and see if it could have been leaking and causing that noise.

[alec_b]

I've also thought about the plug wire issue, as a leaking wire will make close to the same sound as an exhaust tick. But I would tend to think that it would get worse with load, which it doesn't seem like yours is. Nor is mine.

[xtremerevolution]

Then I'll start with the exahust flex pipe and go from there. If that doesn't fix it, then spark plugs and wires.

[Pabz]

After I overhauled my 2.8 in the cutlass due to a broken head bolt the antifreeze gummed up the lifters. I didn't know that it happened until after the engine was assembled. I had major ticking that increased at higher revs. Turned out the lifter was stuck or busted. I would replace them.

Here is a pic of the damage.

 

 

and a link to my project photo album

http://www.ece.ualberta.ca/~ployola/W-body/BrokenHeadBolt/

 

here is a link to my lifter tick video, It doesn't sound like yours though

 

http://www.ece.ualberta.ca/~ployola/W-body/MVI_9654.AVI

Edited April 22, 2010 by Pabz

[xtremerevolution]

Yeah that's definitely not what my car sounds like. It seems the noise is louder when its cold, and then quiets a bit after a while. I'm going to seafoam the car to see if I have an exhaust leak.

[Addicted to eaton]

It does sound like an exhaust leak. that would explain the putting in your exhaust, the leak lets in air, causing a very VERY small backfire.

[xtremerevolution]

It does sound like an exhaust leak. that would explain the putting in your exhaust, the leak lets in air, causing a very VERY small backfire.

 

Don't hold your breath. I replaced the heads (see other thread in the powertrain section), and that got rid of the puttering in the exhaust. I won't rule out the possibility that the broken front engine mount and loose rear engine mount had the engine sititng sideways, putting the exhaust flange at an awkward angle and allowing an exhaust leak, but I'm hoping it was the heads. Otherwise I drove up to Wisconsin for something I could have avoided. Oh well, at least I now have ported heads and a spare set that I can have rebuilt.

 

I'll seafoam this car this weekend to check for an exhaust leak. I sincerely hope it is, since that means I don't have to tear open the engine again.

 

I just put in brand new plugs and wires. One of the plugs looked like it had a black crack on each side of the plug. I'll put up pictures. Car ran slightly better after all was replaced. Duralast wires for $20, and Autolite Double Platinum plugs. I can honestly say it feels just like the ACDelco Rapidfires that were in there before, if not better.

[RobertISaar]

One of the plugs looked like it had a black crack on each side of the plug.

 

hmm...

 

that wouldn't be the first time i've heard of something like that, but i can't remember what it's indicitave of...

[xtremerevolution]

hmm...

 

that wouldn't be the first time i've heard of something like that, but i can't remember what it's indicitave of...

 

I saved all the plugs and wires, so I'll get you a picture tonight.

[RobertISaar]

ALLDATA comes through...

 

does this sound about right?

 

EDIT: i hate the resizing crap...

 

this one is JPG, but shouldn't be smaller than intended.

Edited April 22, 2010 by RobertISaar

[Night Fury]

Sounds like it happened going up the mountain in colo!

[xtremerevolution]

Sounds like it happened going up the mountain in colo!

 

Sure does sound like it!

 

BTW, I can't see that picture. Work blocks lots of websites here, especially photobucket, but surprisingly, not facebook.

[RobertISaar]

Sure does sound like it!

 

BTW, I can't see that picture. Work blocks lots of websites here, especially photobucket, but surprisingly, not facebook.

 

did you check the EDIT? i added a full-size JPG.

[xtremerevolution]

If you're talking about the article, then I saw that.

 

Something interesting happened. I just went to lunch half an hour ago. Started the car, went to a place to eat, everything was fine. Finished eating, got back in the car, started it, SES code, but everything else felt fine. Got to work, shut the car off, restarted it, and SES Code was gone. I'll check for history codes when I get home.

 

Similar thing happened 2 days ago, but ignored it. I was leaving for the day, and the car threw an SES code the moment I turned it on. Tried to restart it 3 times, SES code stayed on. Drove for 2 miles, shut the car down and started it again, SES code was gone and stayed gone till today.

[Night Fury]

If you're talking about the article, then I saw that.

 

Something interesting happened. I just went to lunch half an hour ago. Started the car, went to a place to eat, everything was fine. Finished eating, got back in the car, started it, SES code, but everything else felt fine. Got to work, shut the car off, restarted it, and SES Code was gone. I'll check for history codes when I get home.

 

Similar thing happened 2 days ago, but ignored it. I was leaving for the day, and the car threw an SES code the moment I turned it on. Tried to restart it 3 times, SES code stayed on. Drove for 2 miles, shut the car down and started it again, SES code was gone and stayed gone till today.

 

My 91 does something similar randomly....

[xtremerevolution]

Ok I think I found the source of my problems.

 

Robert, load up this log file. Run through it. I have several WOT runs, several consistent drives in 2nd speed at 50 mph for extended periods of time, and random things. All I can tell you is that my knock counter is flying like Vegas slot machines and I don't remember that happening with the old heads.

 

I'm running down to the gas station to get some premium fuel.

3800.zip

[RobertISaar]

notes:

 

getting a good ~12:1 AFR at WOT.

 

at 5222 RPM, you're hitting a 92.7% injector duty cycle. AFR was still ~12:1 though.

 

your long-term fuel trims before going WOT are showing you running ~16% lean before O2 correction.

 

knock is looking ridiculous, even rolled over the counter 4 times...

 

coolant temp during this process stayed very reasonable.

 

i don't know how prone 3800 heads are to knock(let alone the L27 heads), but DAMN! the PCM even looked like it disregarded it at times and didn't retard spark until the knock was more aggressive...

[xtremerevolution]

Its not the heads I'm worried about, its the pistons.

[tornado_735]

Goddamn.

[xtremerevolution]

Goddamn.

 

Yeah. 40-50 knock per 0-45 WOT run. Not good, at all.

 

I had 3/4 a tank in the car, so I filled up the last 1/4 with 93 octane, and put in a bottle of octane booster. Lets see if this makes a difference.

 

I wonder if this had anything to do with my rough idle. Or, I wonder if this did any damage to my engine that is now causing the rough idle. I really don't know. I'd have to think it through for a while longer.

 

My theory is that if I made such a big difference with the heads, I should theoretically get better airflow, which means more air flows into the pistons. If more air flows into the pistons, more air is compressed at TDC, which means my compression is higher, which means I need higher octane fuel.

[tornado_735]

Yeah. 40-50 knock per 0-45 WOT run. Not good, at all.

 

I had 3/4 a tank in the car, so I filled up the last 1/4 with 93 octane, and put in a bottle of octane booster. Lets see if this makes a difference.

 

I wonder if this had anything to do with my rough idle. Or, I wonder if this did any damage to my engine that is now causing the rough idle. I really don't know. I'd have to think it through for a while longer.

 

My theory is that if I made such a big difference with the heads, I should theoretically get better airflow, which means more air flows into the pistons. If more air flows into the pistons, more air is compressed at TDC, which means my compression is higher, which means I need higher octane fuel.

 

I hope your theory is correct.

 

If not, I have a 163K mile L27 in my Olds...