xtremerevolution Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 I'd like to start planning an L67 swap for the regal. The series 1 3800 is nice but its not impressive. What should be my budget for the project? I'll need an engine lift. I'd like a low mileage engine and transmission, and a newer radiator as well. How much should I expect this all to cost me? edit... I am now considering other engines for this prospective project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 I've noticed that the prices tend to vary fairly greatly to peoples locales. best bet would probably be use the 98/99 MC/Lumina 3800 engine harness, I'd consider buying a wrecked up second gen to use for the engine and part the rest out. that way you can at least drive it beforehand so you know that the engine runs right and that everything in the trans is good. Your radiator should be fine for the job. I would consider using a engine from a L36 w-body myself as 3.29 gearing kicks the crap out of the stock L67 gears of 2.89. But make sure to swap in the L67 diff and other hard parts. I don't know if you are budgeting on PCM tuning but for that much you'll either need someone to do it for you or buy a HPtuners or PowerTuner setup to get it set right for the diferent gearing. I would budget far more then you realistically think you'll spend on it, usually what you think + 60% as everything car related always goes waaay over budget. My personal number would be around $2500. And before someone slams me for that number, I am taking into account everything that can go wrong going wrong and making sure you do a good job the first time without cutting corners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted December 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 $2500 sounds good. Better to have too much than too little. I'd probably stick with a direct drop-in engine and trans for simplicity. Those gears would give me better fuel economy anyway, and the aftermarket is endless. Could I use the harness from a donor car? What I really want is a Turbo 3800 to make it a Turbo regal, but that would be expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 Its not near as direct a replacement as the 98/99 3800 lumina/MC one is. It still has to be modified however, and what those mods are, I do not know. I know DigitalOutsider has one he is looking to unload if you are interested, its been a few years now but IIRC the only wires that are cut are for the rear o2 sensor. Supercharge it today, turbo it some other day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavarium454 Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 I got a harness out of a 98 MC that I bought from Milzy Motorsports that I would let go for far less than the 250 I paid. Yeah lets just say I didn't factor in the +60% and now I'm going back to the 3.4 DOHC in my 95 GTP and ended up putting the motor in my 97 and selling the trans. The series II kicks ass though, I must say I was impressed when I first took the 97 out for a joy ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no1kicker Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Low mile L26 engines can be had for cheap, sometimes you can get the whole engine for 4-500. What mods do you want? Here's a breakdown of costs that I randomly came up with. L26 engine to use the shortblock 400 sell L26 intakes, rail, inj, heads -100 L67 top end swap 350 1.9 rockers used 150 PEM's and DP 300 low mile GTP trans 600 L67 harness and PCM 150 used MPS and 3.4 pulley 70 gaskets, fluids, hoses, bolts 200 modified axles for swap 150 I'm sure I'm missing some stuff, but that list above comes out to ~2400. You can save money by starting with a junk harness for cheap, and getting someone with a powertuner to program the pcm for you. I'm assuming you can use your existing motor mounts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavarium454 Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 It would be far cheaper for him to buy a wrecked GTP. You can pick them up for about 800-1000. And when I bought my L67 I got the motor, trans, pcm, axles, and MSD ignition without me having touch the car in any way for 900 dollars. Just be patient and don't go hoping on the first motor/trans ect. you see for sale and scope out some other deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted December 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 It would be far cheaper for him to buy a wrecked GTP. You can pick them up for about 800-1000. And when I bought my L67 I got the motor, trans, pcm, axles, and MSD ignition without me having touch the car in any way for 900 dollars. Just be patient and don't go hoping on the first motor/trans ect. you see for sale and scope out some other deals. That's probably what I'll end up having to do. I just want to drop an engine in for now; I can worry about rockers and other go-fast mods later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no1kicker Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Yes that would definitely be cheaper, plus there are other parts to resell and make money back. You would have everything needed like accessories also. But chances are the wrecked car would be high mileage. It depends on what you want out of the swap. The list I posted includes some beginner mods that IMO most people would want, if not want more like headers, cam, etc. It also would give you a low mileage setup at least for the engine and trans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavarium454 Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 True, but half the battle is just getting the damn thing to run in a car it was not meant to go in. No matter what route he takes though, he would be set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 I've seen some junk, but running, GTP's popping up on craigslist recently for relatively cheap. Would be a good start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgethis Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Its not near as direct a replacement as the 98/99 3800 lumina/MC one is. It still has to be modified however, and what those mods are, I do not know. I know DigitalOutsider has one he is looking to unload if you are interested, its been a few years now but IIRC the only wires that are cut are for the rear o2 sensor. Really? so my 98 lumina would be one of the non-problem child's to do a direct swap of a l67. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Twincharge or bust! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubsfan24 Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Its not near as direct a replacement as the 98/99 3800 lumina/MC one is. It still has to be modified however, and what those mods are, I do not know. I know DigitalOutsider has one he is looking to unload if you are interested, its been a few years now but IIRC the only wires that are cut are for the rear o2 sensor. Really? so my 98 lumina would be one of the non-problem child's to do a direct swap of a l67. No, they were talking about using a harness from a 98/99 3800. You would also need a harness out of a 3800 monte/lumina to do a l67 swap since you have a 3100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgethis Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Its not near as direct a replacement as the 98/99 3800 lumina/MC one is. It still has to be modified however, and what those mods are, I do not know. I know DigitalOutsider has one he is looking to unload if you are interested, its been a few years now but IIRC the only wires that are cut are for the rear o2 sensor. No, they were talking about using a harness from a 98/99 3800. You would also need a harness out of a 3800 monte/lumina to do a l67 swap since you have a 3100. Thanks Cubs, wishful thinking i guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavarium454 Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 Its not near as direct a replacement as the 98/99 3800 lumina/MC one is. It still has to be modified however, and what those mods are, I do not know. I know DigitalOutsider has one he is looking to unload if you are interested, its been a few years now but IIRC the only wires that are cut are for the rear o2 sensor. No, they were talking about using a harness from a 98/99 3800. You would also need a harness out of a 3800 monte/lumina to do a l67 swap since you have a 3100. Thanks Cubs, wishful thinking i guess It would be slightly easier since you wouldn't have to convert to OBD II and a majority of your pins in the harness would remain the same if you got a 3800 harness out of a Lumina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Euro Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 Twincharge or bust! not worth the $$ IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted January 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 I have some ideas here. I'd like to put down 250hp to the wheels. I'm assuming that would equate to low-mid 14's in the 1/4 mile. I'm not interested in much more power than that out of my Regal. I have bigger ideas for the Jaguar. If I don't use an L67, is there an easier way to do this? Is there a better engine that would give me the same results for cheaper, even if it required heavy modification? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Fury Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 Throw in a L32 and you're pretty much guaranteed 250 HP! <3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted January 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 Throw in a L32 and you're pretty much guaranteed 250 HP! <3 Yeah, at the crank, not at the wheels. I want to know what engine will get me to 250hp at the wheels the easiest and least expensive. I'd like to build up a motor and then drop it in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 how much do you like to fab? superdave from V6Z24/60V6 and other sites has a 3500 pushing 275WHP in a Z24 running a flat 13 through a 5 speed... http://www.v6z24.com/registry/SuperDave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted January 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 how much do you like to fab? superdave from V6Z24/60V6 and other sites has a 3500 pushing 275WHP in a Z24 running a flat 13 through a 5 speed... http://www.v6z24.com/registry/SuperDave That all depends on the difficulty in said fabrication and the cost associated. I have hand tools and air tools, and will probably buy a nice compressor (30 gal) if needed. I'm not new to porting and polishing, and I think I did a damn good job with those Jag heads and intakes, so tearing an engine to port and polish intakes and heads is probably going to be done anyway. I want it to be beautiful, but not overly expensive. They say I can swap an L67 for $2500. Can I do better with a different engine at around the same cost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertISaar Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 dunno. if your fab skills are up to par, a turbo 3500 is a beast... but if you do decide to go 3800, do yourself a favor and port the living piss out of the heads. they suck for flow. large port 3100 heads flow roughly the same air with 22% less displacement, which is why the powerband of a 3800 favors low-rpm while a 3100 favors the top. EDIT: just looked again. the 3800 and LP3100 exhaust are damn near identical, but the LP3100 flows ~220cfm at .600, while the L67 heads flow ~194 at .600... see attached photos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 Your easiest and best bet- L67. 250 to the wheels N/A is going to be pretty expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtremerevolution Posted January 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 Your easiest and best bet- L67. 250 to the wheels N/A is going to be pretty expensive. That's what I was thinking. There must be a reason why the L67 is the engine of choice for the vast majority of 1st gen engine swaps. The 3500 Turbo must be pretty insane, but also expensive. Sounds great, but sounds not so great at the same time. Maybe when I have a house almost paid off. As for the 3800 heads, are you entirely sure its the ports on the heads that cause the air restriction? How big are the valve diameters in comparison, the compression ratios, and how are the cams in regard to lift, as those can definitely affect the flow of the heads. In all honesty, 250 to the wheels was a rough number. I want my Regal to go faster than my Bonneville, and still have the ability to make faster in the future. I'd consider a northstar were it not for head bolt issues and the fabrication required to get it to run in a 1st gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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