SuperBuick Posted September 2, 2003 Report Share Posted September 2, 2003 I know that 5 speed cars use a different chip, and I am trying to understand why. I really want to convert my 3800 series 1 regal to a stick shift but I'm nervous it will run funny/suffer driveability issues without 5-speed specific programming (of which none was ever made). I can get a custom flywheel made, the tranny bolts up, and all the pedal mounts are there-the only issue is the chip. Any ideas/suggestions on how to make this happen? Can it simply be ignored? -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGPilot Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Well you will need a chip to be programmed to not care about the tranny and what gear it is in. Most of the newer trannies will limit torque output to "save" the tranny. When I did the 5-speed swap into my TGP it was a frikkin bear (in a BAD way) with a stock or otherwise TGP chip. Knock, stalls, severely irratic idle speeds, just to name a few. I would think with a 3800 it has a 4T60-e tranny and this is a completely computer controlled tranny and the ECM will most likely freak out if it does not see what gear the car is in. I don't know this for sure so some serious research would be needed.. 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted September 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Hey Kenny, Well, the 3800 Series 1 in 1990 (the year of superbuick) was mated to the 4t60 (440t4) vacuum tranny - same as in the TGP just not beefed up. The issue i guess is that the series 1 3800 was never in any vehicle or form mated to a 5 speed (like the 3.1 n/a was). Would it still be programmable? Something you could do? -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted September 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 For the sake of I don't know what, here is a response I got from a guy who has a 3800 mated to a 5 speed in his fiero. http://www.terranexus.com/fieroman/ -----Original Message----- From: R. Lydon Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 10:22 PM To: fieroman@terranexus.com Subject: 3800 5 speed Hello, my name is tom, and I have a 1990 regal coupe with a 3800 v6 that will hopefully be undergoing a getrag 282 5-speed swap. I plan on purchasing the flywheel for this application from west coast fiero, and as such, would i use the same bolts that you used on your fiero? I don't know - if the thickness of the west coast Flywheel is the same as mine, then yes. Most likely it is close enough anyway. Here is a clip from my faq section: What bolts do I use to attach the new flywheel with? I used ARP part number 234-1001, 190 ksi cam bolts. They come three per pack and are available through CV Products @ 1-800-448-1223. I applied a light duty thread locker then torqued them to 29 ft-lbs using a typical cross-center torquing pattern. All continues to be fine years later. In addition, what did you do about the torque converter lockup switch, how did you wire it so the motor did not act up funny, and also the park/neutral switch, so the motor wouldn't think it was in park while getting speed/rpm readings. I took no action withthelockup switch. I wired the gear selector to be in drive all of the time. Based on the GM manual,"drive"isindicated when PCM pins E7 and E2 are grounded and E8 and E3 are open/floating. Note: your year may be different. Please consult the manual for your engine/transmission year. You will find this shown on the PCM schematic on my page inthe3800 section. I appreciate any help you could offer. I am hoping on a succesful swap because the car is like new with only 24000 miles on it, and i don't want to make a beautifully driving car go to hell just because I had to have a 5-speed!!!! thank you for any information you can share with me, it is much appreciated. - Tom Lydon I wish youluck - you will have a unique and exciting car when done. What are you using for a shift console?? I would love to see the pictures when you are done. David C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 If anything it will cause drivability problems, performance would be the same. The idle, decel, and stall saver settings are all different for a 5spd, the spark and fuel tables are sometimes slightly different but probably not very noticable. I'd guess at worse you'll have stalling and chugging occasionally, the auto ECM figures there is always a load on the engine which with the 5spd there is not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGPilot Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 The link you attached is not working for me. I do not have access to an EPROM station anymore so sorry I can not do anything with the chips anymore... 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted September 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Brian - since the car is my daily driver - drivability is the main concern. I can't avoid to have stalling and stuff. Kenny - I fixed the link. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 The link you attached is not working for me. I do not have access to an EPROM station anymore so sorry I can not do anything with the chips anymore... 8) . oh well i'll get it figured out. there is a guy in Loveland that does them i think but i still need to check into it. SuperBuick - i wasn't sure if you were still interested in the 5-speed swap or not. i remember telling you i can get you the small stuff (several cars i can get this stuff from around here), but if you can find a complete donor car that would be the easiest way. good luck and let us know how it goes. joshua Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 I don't know if you'll have problems or not, but if you do thats what you;ll get. Might want to hunt down some fiero owners that have swapped in a 3800 and see what they did chip wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted September 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Joshua, Well my keeping the car is dependent on whether or not I can get this done. I am done with automatic transmissions for good. I hate them enough that I can't even stand to drive the Buick anymore. I have to have a stick shift. If I can't find a way to make the Buick into one for a reasonable amount of dough (whilst preserving daily driveability), I will be selling the car. I know it sounds silly - but I REALLY despise automatics. hehe. So...I am still very interested in doing this (especially now that I can afford it), but if it is not doable...bye bye SuperBuick. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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