Brake lights stay on

[CortxVortx]

My son's '89 Buick Regal had the battery drain this week. We took it out and returned it to Auto Zone for a recharge.

 

We reinstalled the battery and drove around a while to make sure it was charged.

 

When we returned home, we found that the brake lights stayed on, even though the car had been turned off. We pulled the fuse to turn them off.

 

So what caused this? That stupid brake light switch up under the steering wheel (it's a bitch to change)? A wire grounding out somewhere? Any hints or kibbitzing welcomed.

[Redfox340]

Well, I'd say the brake switch since it had a minor recall on them.

But, it's located on the brake pedal itself.

Get underneath and have a look; it'll be near the brake pedal axle, a white plastic housing.

However before replacing, there's a procedure to "re-set" where the brake light switch engages / closes the circuit.

I'll see if I can dig that up and get that to ya'.

 

- Erik

[Slade901]

I had the same problem with my 1990 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme.

 

Try pulling the brake pedal up and see if the brake lights turns off. If it does turns off when you pull up the brake pedal, then you might want to put a spring on the brake pedal so it will fully pulls up.

 

On my car, I tried pulling the brake pedal but it won't turn off the brake lights. So, what I did was to disconnect the brake switch from the brake pedal ( the brake switch has a hole where it goes to the 1/4 inch rod on the brake pedal itself).

Once the brake switch was removed from the brake pedal, I tried pulling the brake switch (plastic) and the brake light turned off. So, I figured out that the brake switch is not fully extending to turn off because the brake pedal won't up anymore further.

What I did was put back the brake switch (plastic), but I did not put the plastic hole on the brake pedal rod. Instead, I put the plastic switch just below the rod and wrap a wire around the plastic switch onto the brake pedal. So, basically what ended up happening is that now the brake switch is extended just enough that when the pedal is not pushed down, the plastic brake switch is off. I have this setup for 4 years now and it works fine.

[CortxVortx]

Redfox:

 

If you come across that information, I'd really appreciate receiving it.

 

Slade:

 

Thanks for the jerry-rigging suggestion. I did a lot of that on my '64 Bel Air. I don't look forward to wriggling up under the dashboard again, but hey, that's the fun of an old car.

 

In the meantime, it keeps my son off the streets and in the backyard where he belongs!

[GnatGoSplat]

You might call the dealer and see if you can get this fixed free. There was a recall on the switch for the exact same problem you're describing.

[xyanth2003]

I noticed on my 95' GP that the catpeted peice under the dash had moved or somthing and was holding the brake down so I just cut out a larger hole a poof problem gone.

[CortxVortx]

Thanks to all y'all for your input.

 

Those of you who have wrestled the brake switch from an '89 Regal (I assume other W-bodies are similar) can sympathize when I say, "Whoever designed that rig can suck my wrinkled nut sack!"

 

First off, run both front seats as far back on their rails as possible. Recline the seatbacks fully. Tilt the console/armrest back. Invert your body so that your head is where your feet should be, and your feet are straddling the headrests. (You might want to vacuum the carpet, too.)

 

Take off the dress panel (I suppose it's called). Remove a dash panel with an a/c duct; detach that, too.

 

1/2" socket removes 3 of the 4 bolts holding the steering column. The four requires a crescent wrench because it's right behind an a/c pipe (I guess).

 

(Here's where extra hands come in) -- have someone hold the steering wheel off your chest and hand you tools, flashlight, parts, etc.

 

Now, if you're double-jointed enough, you can look up past the brake pedal to the brake light switch. Its a roughly triangular piece of white plastic. Unplug the brakelight jack (I used a screwdriver to depress the latch). There's an arm sticking from the switch housing that fits into a hole in this metal wall that's designed to be in your way. Pull that out.

 

The top of the switch housing is a C-shaped clip that fits on the brake pedal's swivel; it pulls right off. Now unplug a small jack (cruise control?) from the housing, slip the lever off the peg on the brake pedal, and it's off.

 

Simple? Bullshit. Took me over two hours.

 

The switch didn't look burned (like the previous one did), but the lever didn't travel freely, either. We bopped up to Auto Zone and got a replacement for $18.

 

Getting the mofo back in was even harder, since I had to guide it by touch. My hands got in my line of sight, thanks to aforementioned metal wall. When I finally did get it installed, my son said, "Brake lights are still on."

 

(If you're wondering why my son didn't work on it himself, it's because I barely fit my body under the dash and my hands barely fit in the opening -- he'd be hopeless. I let him hold up the steering wheel.)

 

I pulled the switch from its mounting and worked the lever back and forth. My son reported that the lights went off and on. So the switch worked -- except when installed, because the lever didn't come far enough forward when the brake pedal was at rest.

 

Taking the switch out, we retired to the dining table for sips and pondering. The switch contacts could be seen through the translucent plastic. The main one looked like a clothespin. When it was closed, the lights came on. When the brake pedal was at rest, a triangular piece pushed open the clothespin and the lights went off.

 

My son soon realized that the triangular piece was mounted on an adjustable slide. A spring acted as a ratchet to hold the slide in place. We racked that doofus all the way out, and it was back to GM hell to reinstall it.

 

After much huffing and puffing (due to knocking the spring against the firewall and resetting the slide a couple of times), I got the thing back in, and lo! The brake lights were off.

 

Just another five minutes to reconnect the small jack, then another five minutes to bolt the steering wheel back in place (to hell with the panels, my son said), the Regal is roadworthy again.

 

Now we can go get an Oklahoma license plate for it. (There doesn't seem to be state safety inspections here.)

 

Damn snap-together cars!

[GnatGoSplat]

For those who get lucky, it may be covered under recall.

 

Product Safety - Brake Stoplamp Switch #90C08 - (01/21/2003)

90-C-08 -- Brake Stoplamp Switch

1989-1990 Buick Regal

 

The National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act, as amended, provides that each vehicle which is subject to a recall campaign of this type must be adequately repaired within a reasonable time after the owner has tendered it for repair. A failure to repair within sixty (60) days after tender of a vehicle is prima facie evidence of failure to repair within a reasonable time.

 

If the condition is not adequately repaired within a reasonable time, the owner may be entitled to an identical or reasonably equivalent vehicle at no charge or to a refund of the purchase price less a reasonable allowance for depreciation.

 

To avoid having to provide these burdensome solutions, every effort must be made to promptly schedule an appointment with each owner and to repair their vehicle as soon as possible. As you will see in reading the attached copy of the better that is being sent to owners, the owners are being instructed to contact the Buick Customer Assistance Center if their dealer does not remedy the condition within five (5) days of the mutually agreed upon service date. If the condition is not remedied within a reasonable time, they are instructed on how to contact the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.

 

Condition

General Motors has determined that a defect which related to motor vehicle safety exists in certain 1989 and 1990 Buick Regal model vehicles. These vehicles may have a faulty brake stoplamp switch, which could result in the stoplamps not illuminating on application of the brakes. If this should occur in situations where a driver in a trailering vehicle is otherwise unable to recognize a braking action in sufficient time to respond appropriately, a vehicle crash could occur without prior warning. In some cases, failure of the stoplamp switch can result in the stoplamps staying on at all times.

 

In addition, in vehicles equipped with cruise control, a faulty stoplamp switch can result in resumption of the cruise control function upon release of the brake pedal. If this occurs, the cruise control feature can be disengaged by moving the cruise control switch to the OFF position, of by reapplying the brake. Once the vehicle speeds drops below 12-14 mph, the cruise feature will be automatically disengaged.

 

To prevent these conditions from occurring, an improved stoplamp switch will be installed on all involved vehicles.

 

Vehicles Involved

Involved are certain 1989 and 1990 Buick Regal model vehicles built within the following VIN breakpoints:

 

Year

Model

Plant

From

Through and Including

 

1989

Regal

Oshawa #2

K1445106

K1488782

 

1990

Regal

Oshawa #2

L1400251

L1431378

 

 

Vehicles which Buick records indicate were previously repaired under warranty with Stoplamp Switch, P/N 10180504, are not included in this campaign.

 

Owner Notification

Owners will be notified of this campaign on their vehicles by Buick Motor Division (see copy of owner letter included with this bulletin).

 

Change of Owner Information

Dealers are to use the Dealer Communication System (DCS) to provide Buick Motor Division with subsequent Buick owner information. By reporting a change of owner or address of a vehicle in campaign status over the DCS, the need to send a CVAR form for that vehicle is eliminated. Terminal input instructions are covered in the DCS Manual under Section 9, page 9-J01A and B.

 

Dealer Recall Responsibility

Dealers are to service all vehicles subject to this campaign at no charge to owners, regardless of mileage, age of vehicle, or ownership, from this time forward.

 

Whenever a vehicle subject to this campaign is taken into your new or used vehicle inventory, or it is in your dealership for service in the future, you should take the steps necessary to be sure the campaign correction has been made before reselling or releasing the vehicle.

 

Owners of vehicles recently sold from your new vehicle inventory are to be contacted by the dealer, and arrangements made to make the required correction according to instructions contained in this bulletin.

 

Dealer Material

If your dealership has vehicles involved in this campaign, you will receive the following items:

 

List of all vehicles involved in this campaign assigned to your dealership.

One (1) Campaign Identification Label per vehicle involved.

Involved vehicles have been identified by Vehicle Identification Number. Computer listings contain the complete Vehicle Identification Number, owner name and address data, and are furnished to involved dealers with the campaign bulletin. Owner name and address data furnished will enable dealers to follow-up with owners involved in this campaign.

 

These listings may contain owner names and addresses obtained from State Motor Vehicle Registration Records. The use of such motor vehicle registration data for any other purposes is a violation of law in several states. Accordingly, you are urged to limit the use of this listing to the follow-up necessary to complete this campaign. Any dealer not receiving a computer listing with the campaign bulletin has no involved vehicles currently assigned.

 

Reimbursement

Customers with reimbursement claims should have their repair orders reviewed to determine if an improved design stoplamp switch (P/N 10180504) was installed at the time of repair.

 

If the part number on the repair order is P/N 10180504, no further action is required. Claim V6372 and reimburse the customer under T1690.

If the part number on the repair order is not P/N 10180504, an improved design stoplamp switch (P/N 10180504) must still be installed. Perform the campaign procedure outlined in this bulletin, claim V6371 for the replacement and reimburse the customer for the prior repair under T1690.

Customer requests for reimbursement of previous repairs to correct a stoplamp switch condition are to be submitted according to the instructions included with this bulletin. Owners must submit ORIGINAL DOCUMENTATION that reasonably confirms the amount of unreimbursed repair expense, a description of the repair, the date of the repair, and the person or entity performing the repair.

 

Parts Information

Parts required to complete this campaign are to be obtained from General Motors Service Parts Operations (GMSPO). To ensure these parts will be obtained as soon as possible, they should be ordered from GMSPO on a "C.I.O" order with NO special instruction code, but on an advise code (2).

 

Part Number

Description

Qty

 

10180504

Stoplamp Switch Assembly

1

 

 

GMSPO will preship each dealer five (5) stoplamp switch assemblies. These parts will be billed on the dealer parts account.

 

Service Procedure

 

Important

ALL DEALERS ARE BEING SENT AN INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEO TAPE ON THE STOPLAMP SWITCH SETTING PROCEDURE. PLEASE BE SURE TO VIEW THIS VIDEO BEFORE PERFORMING THE PROCEDURE BELOW. FLEET WARRANTY STATIONS INTENDING TO PERFORM THIS CAMPAIGN MAY OBTAIN THIS VIDEOTAPE BY CALLING (313) 525-8200 BEFORE DECEMBER 14, 1990 AND ASK FOR HANK BOLSEN.

 

 

Stoplamp Switch Removal and Installation

Remove the air cleaner assembly and disconnect the negative battery cable.

Remove the left side insulator panel and slide the steering shaft protective sleeve towards the cowl.

Remove the air distribution tube and pull down.

Remove the retainer clip holding the stoplamp switch to the column bracket.

Disconnect the switch arm from the pedal by pushing the arm over an doff the brake pedal pin. Release the switch by pulling it down and releasing the top snap clip.

Disconnect the connector position assurance (CPA) locking pins from the four wire and two wire electrical connectors. (The two wire connector is not present on vehicles without the cruise control feature.)

Disconnect the four wire and the two wire connectors.

Remove the brake stoplamp switch assembly.

If the vehicle is equipped with cruise control, connect the two wire connector and the CPA locking pin to the new switch assembly.

Install the new switch assembly by pushing the switch up until seated into the top snap clip. DO NOT attach the switch arm to the pin on the brake pedal at this time.

 

Important

Make sure the brake switch is NOT adjusted (metal clip on the actuator is not engaged with the serrations on the bottom of the carrier) as shown in Figure 2.

 

 

Install the retainer clip which holds the switch to the steering column bracket.

Push the brake pedal down to the floor pan and install the switch arm over and onto the brake pedal pin.

Pull the brake pedal all the way rearward and listen for the switch to ratchet to the set position. AT LEAST THREE (3) CLICKS OF THE RATCHET MUST BE HEARD.

Connect the four wire connector and the CPA locking pin.

Position the steering shaft protective sleeve.

Reconnect the negative battery cable.

Inspect the stoplamp switch operation. If the stoplamps DO NOT operate, refer to the Stoplamp Switch Adjustment section of this bulletin. If the stoplamps DO operate, continue through Step 23.

Check the setting of the cruise vacuum dump, if so equipped. With the brake pedal at rest, make sure the plunger is fully seated into the barrel. If it is not fully seated, push the dump valve forward until the plunger is inside the barrel and then pull rearward on the brake pedal to properly set the valve. If the plunger is already fully seated into the barrel, the vacuum dump valve is already properly set and no further adjustment is required.

Reconnect the air distribution tube.

Reinstall the left side sound insulator panel.

Reinstall the air cleaner assembly.

Vehicles equipped with the 2.8L and 3.1L engines must have the following procedure performed to "relearn" the idle. This function was lost from the ECM's memory due to the loss of battery power.

Place the air conditioning controls in the OFF position.

Firmly apply the parking brake and block the drive wheels. Start the engine and shift the transaxle into DRIVE.

Allow the engine to run a maximum of 10 minutes or until the engine cooling fan has cycled once, whichever occurs first.

Shift the transaxle to PARK, then turn the ignition key to the OFF position for at least 5 seconds.

Repeat Step B.

Allow the engine to run for at least 5 minutes.

Install the Campaign Identification Label.

Stoplamp Switch Adjustment

Figures 1 through 5 may be helpful in performing this procedure.

 

Depress the brake pedal as far as possible and hold.

Using a stiff wire and a hooked end (refer to Figures 4 and 5), gently pull the switch set lever forward (toward the front of the vehicle), and listen for an audible click indicating release of the automatic adjuster.

 

Important

If no click is heard, release the brake pedal and repeat the procedure above.

 

 

After release of the automatic adjuster, pull the brake pedal all the way rearward. Listen for the switch to ratchet into the set position (setting the stoplamp switch). At least three (3) clicks of the ratchet must be heard.

Inspect the operation of the stoplamps. The stoplamps should operate at maximum brake pedal travel of 25 mm (1 in) and throughout the remainder of its travel. If the stoplamps DO NOT operate properly, repeat the switch adjustment procedure one more time. If the switch still fails to operate properly, refer to the Stoplamp Switch Adjustment Check chart (refer to Figure 4). If the stoplamps do operate properly, return to Step 17 of the Stoplamp Switch Removal and Installation procedure above.

FIGURE Figure 1 - Stoplamp Switch©

 

 

 

 

FIGURE Figure 2 - Stoplamp Switch Cutaway View©

 

 

 

 

FIGURE Figure 3 - Stoplamp Switch Adjustment Check©

 

 

 

 

FIGURE Figure 4 - Brake Switch Release Tool©

 

 

 

 

FIGURE Figure 5 - Releasing Brake Stoplamp Switch©

 

 

 

 

Campaign Identification Label

Each vehicle corrected in accordance with the instructions outlined in this Product Campaign Bulletin will require a "Campaign Identification Label." Each label provides a space to include the five (5) digit dealer code of the dealer performing the campaign service. This information may be inserted with a typewriter or a ball point pen.

 

Each "Campaign Identification Label" is to be located on the radiator core support in an area which will be visible when the vehicle is brought in for periodic servicing by the owner.

 

Apply the "Campaign Identification Label" only on a clean, dry surface.

 

Disposition of Parts

Replaced parts must be held for disposition by Buick Zone or Branch contact personnel. Parts must have a claim tag attached showing the repair order and the VIN of the vehicle from which they were removed.

 

Warranty Information

Use the "T" labor operation for reimbursement for previous customer paid repair. The Product Campaign must still be performed and the appropriate labor operation used.

 

Operation

Part Count

Failed Part No.

Parts Allow

Failure Code

Labor Op

Labor Hours*

Other Hours

 

Install and Adjust Stoplamp Switch

1

10180504

**

96

V6371

0.8

0.1*

 

Review Repair Order, 10180504 Switch Already Installed

--

--

--

96

V6372***

0.2

0.1*

 

Reimbursement for Previously Customer Paid Stoplamp Switch Repair

--

--

--

96

T1690

See instructions for reimbursement.

 

* -- Dealer Administrative Allowance

 

** -- List current dealer price, plus 30%

 

*** -- V6372 operation to be used only with T1690 operation when part number 10180504 has been previously installed.

 

 

Request for Reimbursement Instructions

Customer presents dealer with original paid receipts covering repairs.

Dealer completes a Repair Order (R.O.) showing the following:

Repair order date

Vehicle Identification Number

Current mileage

Owner's address

Attaches original owner's or dealer's paid invoices/receipts covering repair

Use Labor Operation Number T1690 and Failure Code 96

Enters total of reimbursement based on 100% of OWNER'S EXPENSE

Owner signs the repair order as acknowledgment of requested reimbursement amount.

Owner is given a copy of repair order.

Dealer assigns a Warranty Management System (WMS) authorization code to the claim and enters it on the WMS Authorization Log.

The dealer submits a claim to Buick for processing.

Dealer issues the owner a reimbursement check for the approved amount. The check number must be entered on the repair order and a copy of the check must be attached to the original paid invoices/receipts.

All supporting documentation must be available for review by Buick personnel as needed.

 

Important

Refer to Buick Service Policies and Procedures Manual, Section 1.6.1 for specific procedures for customer reimbursement verification.

 

In the event the Dealer Service Manager and the owner cannot reach agreement on the amount eligible for reimbursement after review of invoices/receipts, the Zone/Branch should be contacted for determination of covered expenses. In such cases, an explanation should be included on the R.O.

 

 

 

Dear Buick Owner:

 

This notice is sent to you in accordance with the requirements of the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act.

 

Reason For This Recall

General Motors has determined that a defect which related to motor vehicle safety exists in certain 1989 and 1990 Buick Regal model vehicles. These vehicles may have a faulty brake stoplamp switch, which could result in the stoplamps not illuminating on application of the brakes. If this should occur in situations where a driver in a trailering vehicle is otherwise unable to recognize a braking action in sufficient time to respond appropriately, a vehicle crash could occur without prior warning. In some cases, failure of the stoplamp switch can result in the stoplamps staying on at all times.

 

In addition, in vehicles equipped with cruise control, a faulty stoplamp switch can result in resumption of the cruise control function upon release of the brake pedal. If this occurs, the cruise control feature can be disengaged by moving the cruise control switch to the OFF position, of by reapplying the brake. Once the vehicle speeds drops below 12-14 mph, the cruise feature will be automatically disengaged.

 

What We Will Do

To prevent these conditions from occurring, an improved design stoplamp switch will be installed on your vehicle. This service will be performed for you at no charge .

 

What You Should Do

Please contact your Buick dealer as soon as possible to arrange a service date. Instructions for making this correction have been sent to your dealer and parts are available. The labor time necessary to perform this service correction is approximately fifty (50) minutes. Please ask your dealer if you wish to know how much additional time will be needed to schedule and process your vehicle.

 

If you have already experienced this condition and paid for all or part of the repair, you may request reimbursement through your Buick dealer. When doing so, you should present the dealer with documentation which reasonably confirms the amount of unreimbursed repair expense, the date of repair and the person or entity performing the repair.

 

When you make your reimbursement request, your repair order will be reviewed to assure that an improved design stoplamp switch was installed. If another switch was used for the repair, it will need to be replaced and a service date to perform this campaign should be scheduled. If the improved design part was installed, your vehicle already has the required part and no further action is necessary. In either case, a claim for reimbursement of the prior repair may be filed.

 

Your Buick dealer is best equipped to obtain parts and provide service to ensure that your vehicle is corrected as promptly as possible. If, however, you take your vehicle to your dealer on the agreed service date and they do not remedy this condition on that date or within five (5) days, we recommend you contact the Buick Customer Assistance Center by calling 1-800-521-7300.

 

After contacting your dealer and the Customer Assistance Center, if you are still not satisfied that we have done our best to remedy this condition without charge and within a reasonable time, you may wish to write the Administrator, National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, 400 Seventh Street SW, Washington, DC 20590 or call 1-8424-9393 (Washington D.C. resident use 366-0123).

 

The enclosed owner reply card identifies your vehicle. Presentation of this card to your dealer will assist in making the necessary correction in the shortest possible time. If you have sold or traded your vehicle, please let us know by completing the postage paid reply card and returning it to us.

 

We are sorry to cause you this inconvenience; however, we have taken this action in the interest of your safety and continued satisfaction with our products.

 

Buick Motor Division

 

General Motors Corporation

 

Enclosure