"lightning" "cap" "capacitor" or WHATEVER lol

[Garrett Powered]

only problem with that thinking is you arent trying to cure drainage with it. the battery drains when the alt cant push power through a thin straw fast enough to keep it charged. the cap wont do anything for a battery, it actually acts like a battery with a volt gauge on top of it. one of the things you are trying to improve actually is the batteries ability to drain itself.

 

remember the higher the voltage the more power can flow. and every time you reduce resistance you WILL see results on the volt gauge. and voltage is constant through the entire car so if you have the cap in your trunk even you will see the increase in average voltage every time you replace another one of the big 5.

[Joe S.]

I think my car is some sort of freak of automotive nature or something...

I'm only running an 800W amp, two 10" RF P2 Punch subs, and no capacitor, but I have never had the lights dim the least bit when the bass hits.

 

Jamie

The reason behind this is because your stock alt is 105 Amps. Your good for another 200 watts before you would have to make any electrical upgrades.

[Joe S.]

IMO, Caps are a waste of money. Sure, it may help a little, but all you are really doing is throwing another electrical system for your alt to charge, thus putting more stress on your alt, causing it to die faster.

 

The best thing to do in these situations is to buy a HO alt, and 0 gauge wire and do a big 3 upgrade.

[w00tah]

I think the big thing with minor-medium dimming is most people have a weak electrical system to begin with, and they make it worse by adding wire for their amp/s that is too small for the wire run that is made in the car. Hell, I had an 80 amp Ford alt in my old F-250, with ~500 RMS, and the ONLY time I would get more than a .1 volt drop was on test tones with the volume at 3/4's of the way. Even then, it was still less than .5 volts measured at the amp. My friend's Bravada (which had a brand new alt and battery in it) would dim like crazy, with the same amount of power. Dropped over a volt at the amp. He used 8 gauge for his run, I used 4.

 

 

Go do some research for wire size for run length, and know it well. The right wire size can do wonders for minor dimming problems. If you have bad dimming problems, spend the cash to get a good HO alt from Iraggi/Powermaster/etc, do the Big 3, and get a good dry cell battery. That'll cure 99.9% of all dimming you'll ever find.

 

 

 

Kef

[AWeb80]

I think my car is some sort of freak of automotive nature or something...

I'm only running an 800W amp, two 10" RF P2 Punch subs, and no capacitor, but I have never had the lights dim the least bit when the bass hits.

 

Jamie

 

 

meh, I've got a 1000 watt sub amp (prob only pushing 600) a 300 watt amp for my 6x9's and a 200 watt running my 5.25's....never had my lights dim.....

[slick]

IMO, Caps are a waste of money. Sure, it may help a little, but all you are really doing is throwing another electrical system for your alt to charge, thus putting more stress on your alt, causing it to die faster.

 

The best thing to do in these situations is to buy a HO alt, and 0 gauge wire and do a big 3 upgrade.

 

I'm with this guy. That's why I posted up the test on the first page.

[Joe S.]

IMO, Caps are a waste of money. Sure, it may help a little, but all you are really doing is throwing another electrical system for your alt to charge, thus putting more stress on your alt, causing it to die faster.

 

The best thing to do in these situations is to buy a HO alt, and 0 gauge wire and do a big 3 upgrade.

 

I'm with this guy. That's why I posted up the test on the first page.

 

Thank you.

[Joe S.]

I think the big thing with minor-medium dimming is most people have a weak electrical system to begin with, and they make it worse by adding wire for their amp/s that is too small for the wire run that is made in the car. Hell, I had an 80 amp Ford alt in my old F-250, with ~500 RMS, and the ONLY time I would get more than a .1 volt drop was on test tones with the volume at 3/4's of the way. Even then, it was still less than .5 volts measured at the amp. My friend's Bravada (which had a brand new alt and battery in it) would dim like crazy, with the same amount of power. Dropped over a volt at the amp. He used 8 gauge for his run, I used 4.

 

 

Go do some research for wire size for run length, and know it well. The right wire size can do wonders for minor dimming problems. If you have bad dimming problems, spend the cash to get a good HO alt from Iraggi/Powermaster/etc, do the Big 3, and get a good dry cell battery. That'll cure 99.9% of all dimming you'll ever find.

 

 

 

Kef

 

Im not sure about Powermaster, but I know that lately Iraggi has been sending out bad alts to people. Why? I have no idea. I recommend buying alts from DB Electrical. Got my 200 amp alt for $250 shipped and it got to me in 3 days. Haven't had a problem yet.

[Garrett Powered]

the 1st gen cs 130 alt is the problem. it has an external fan on it and inferior compared to the cs 130 d. they could both be 105 amps and it wouldnt matter. I have done the upgrade and it made a world of difference. L-O-L @ caps slowing down my alt in any way. if thats the case you need better wire! I got 2200 watts full blast and still the cap reads 14.7 volts with no drop. if your regulator isnt jumping around trying to figure out what voltage to output the alt can flow assloads of power at 14+ .

 

I got a cs 130 external fan on one of my cars with all custom built battery wires. 2 gauge throughout and still have dimming. I will be doing the swap real soon. I already got a "d" I just have to get the bracket modified.

[Ryan from Ohio]

Always start with proper wiring. Next area is to move into a bigger alternator.

 

Capacitors are not a fix by any means. The only reason people can even call it a bandaid is very easy and explainable.

 

Alternators only produce the amount of current needed. Eventhough your alternator may be rated at 130 Amps, it will go upto 160 or so. At which point the brushes start to burn up- killing your alternator eventually.

 

Now the bandaid part comes in when your drawing enough current where the system is dipping below 12 Volts and only doing so on heavy bass notes. Since its not to terrible the alternator can charge/partially charge a cap up for this instance.

 

Its not correct and its not pretty, but it is what it is. In the end only a small percentage of people fall into that issue. Your just extending your alt a little longer.

 

A cap is useful and fine when you have a fully proper electrical system. The ESR (electrical series resistance) is less than that of the battery and can get the power to the amplifier quicker than pulling electrons through your ground wire- so it drains.

 

And it takes 1 time constant to drain a cap, 5 to charge. Applies to all caps.

 

Ok, Im done now.

[xtremerevolution]

Ok, so run me through this wiring concept. What are the big main wiring components that would need to be replaced? My cap helped decrease dimming in my headlights by quite a bit, but I wouldn't mind fixing any other electrical issues my car may have...

[slick]

Grounds-

Battery to Block

Battery to Chassis

Block to Chassis

 

Positive Cables-

Battery to Alternator

Battery to Aux. Post

[xtremerevolution]

Grounds-

Battery to Block

Battery to Chassis

Block to Chassis

 

Positive Cables-

Battery to Alternator

Battery to Aux. Post

 

Thanks a bunch. I'll probably take care of that this weekend. Anything to ensure that my regal lives as long as possible.

 

Almost up to 179,000.

[slick]

I'd use ATLEAST 4 gauge wire. I personally use 0 gauge wire.

 

Keep in mind here, your grounds are VERY important. Hit any grounding spot with a wire brush to brush away any paint, rust, dirt, etc...

[xtremerevolution]

I'd use ATLEAST 4 gauge wire. I personally use 0 gauge wire.

 

Keep in mind here, your grounds are VERY important. Hit any grounding spot with a wire brush to brush away any paint, rust, dirt, etc...

 

Do I buy these cables pre-made? Or should I create my own? Is it even possible to create your own cables? If so, where would I get the end connectors?

[slick]

Make your own cables.

 

I bought a pack of 25 copper 0 gauge ring terminals on ebay for like $12 shipped.

 

Wire, well thats up to you. 0 gauge amp wire is quite expensive (well http://www.knukonceptz.com is about the cheapest there is, and it's good wire also). A lot of people use welding wire, which I don't recommend due to the strand count.

 

When do you do the alternator to the battery, be sure to put an inline fuse holder with a nice big fuse. I used an ANL style fuse and fuseholder, rated at 150 amp. Oh, and be sure to keep the stock wiring from the alternator to the battery in place, just as a backup.

[xtremerevolution]

Make your own cables.

 

I bought a pack of 25 copper 0 gauge ring terminals on ebay for like $12 shipped.

 

Wire, well thats up to you. 0 gauge amp wire is quite expensive (well http://www.knukonceptz.com is about the cheapest there is, and it's good wire also). A lot of people use welding wire, which I don't recommend due to the strand count.

 

When do you do the alternator to the battery, be sure to put an inline fuse holder with a nice big fuse. I used an ANL style fuse and fuseholder, rated at 150 amp. Oh, and be sure to keep the stock wiring from the alternator to the battery in place, just as a backup.

 

Would I be able to pick up the wiring from some home depot by the foot? If so, how much wiring would I need?

[EviLette]

Holy batman old post! Guess it hadn't dropped off the page yet.

 

Thanks for the info on sizing, reading up and all. TBH though, electrical systems scare me. I know as long as the power source is DC'd I'm safe, but hell... I still wince a little when connecting juice to the battery to jump it. I know not why.

[Garrett Powered]

Make your own cables.

 

I bought a pack of 25 copper 0 gauge ring terminals on ebay for like $12 shipped.

 

Wire, well thats up to you. 0 gauge amp wire is quite expensive (well http://www.knukonceptz.com is about the cheapest there is, and it's good wire also). A lot of people use welding wire, which I don't recommend due to the strand count.

 

When do you do the alternator to the battery, be sure to put an inline fuse holder with a nice big fuse. I used an ANL style fuse and fuseholder, rated at 150 amp. Oh, and be sure to keep the stock wiring from the alternator to the battery in place, just as a backup.

 

its not the strand count its the actual thickness of wire and its not ofc.

[slick]

Knowing that current flows on the outside of the strand of wire, and not through the strand of wire, it makes more sense to have as high of a strand count as possible. Sure, you can have 15 strands of wire in an 8 gauge loom, but it's not going to carry near as much current as a 300 strand count, that is the same thickness as the 15 strands of wire, in the same 8 gauge loom.

[Garrett Powered]

the power travels in a field outside the mass of wire not only the individual strands. like a magnetic field surrounding the cord. lol, is that why you thought they used smaller strands? thats for flexibility.

 

welding cable 4 gauge is smaller than car audio 4 gauge. at least at Industrial Source, the local welders supply store. you would think 4 gauge is 4 gauge but... measured in metric vs standard????

[Garrett Powered]

Oh, and be sure to keep the stock wiring from the alternator to the battery in place, just as a backup.

 

there is no alt to batt wire stock. it goes to the starter.

 

you wont need that one though, it will split up your current flow anyway.

 

all you need is the plug on the alt for that. the plug has a backup wire believe it or not. so the alt's charge post can be dedicated to supplying all the power to the aux post with more voltage at higher efficiency. then you dont have to worry about having a backup, while at the same time all the output is directed to one place where it can all be utilized with no unnecessary draws.

[Garrett Powered]

Always start with proper wiring. Next area is to move into a bigger alternator.

 

Capacitors are not a fix by any means. The only reason people can even call it a bandaid is very easy and explainable.

 

Alternators only produce the amount of current needed. Eventhough your alternator may be rated at 130 Amps, it will go upto 160 or so. At which point the brushes start to burn up- killing your alternator eventually.

 

Now the bandaid part comes in when your drawing enough current where the system is dipping below 12 Volts and only doing so on heavy bass notes. Since its not to terrible the alternator can charge/partially charge a cap up for this instance.

 

Its not correct and its not pretty, but it is what it is. In the end only a small percentage of people fall into that issue. Your just extending your alt a little longer.

 

A cap is useful and fine when you have a fully proper electrical system. The ESR (electrical series resistance) is less than that of the battery and can get the power to the amplifier quicker than pulling electrons through your ground wire- so it drains.

 

And it takes 1 time constant to drain a cap, 5 to charge. Applies to all caps.

 

Ok, Im done now.

 

 

wait who has a healthy charging system that dips below 12 volts? mine never dips below 13 volts and thats full blast 2200 watts.

 

my cap never needs to charge. it stays charged. how do you come up with these figures of time constances? at what voltage? mine charges so fast that it sparks when you touch a cable to it. basically charges instantaneously at 14 volts.

 

alternater too. what voltage is it pushing 160 amps? there is a huge difference between 13 and 14 volts. thats why its so damn important that you disconnect the factory charge wire when you do the charge wire upgrade. you need to have full 14 volts. 13 sounds pretty good but it aint shit when you need a lot of power for your amps. the alt is not nearly as efficient. it should never read 12 on your cap unless you had the car off for a while and stereo running. then you should turn on the car and see 14.9 to 15.1 immediately for a while then when the battery charges for a while then see it taper down to 14.3 or so.

 

my cap is my cars health meter. I guess you can call it a bandaid. more like a heart monitor.

[Ryan from Ohio]

the power travels in a field outside the mass of wire not only the individual strands. like a magnetic field surrounding the cord. lol, is that why you thought they used smaller strands? thats for flexibility.

 

welding cable 4 gauge is smaller than car audio 4 gauge. at least at Industrial Source, the local welders supply store. you would think 4 gauge is 4 gauge but... measured in metric vs standard????

 

Properly sized 4 ga will carry the same current no matter how many strands present. All the strand count is for is flexiblity. The mroe strands you have, the larger the core group of wire is (not outside!).

[Ryan from Ohio]

wait who has a healthy charging system that dips below 12 volts? mine never dips below 13 volts and thats full blast 2200 watts.

 

my cap never needs to charge. it stays charged. how do you come up with these figures of time constances? at what voltage? mine charges so fast that it sparks when you touch a cable to it. basically charges instantaneously at 14 volts.

 

alternater too. what voltage is it pushing 160 amps? there is a huge difference between 13 and 14 volts. thats why its so damn important that you disconnect the factory charge wire when you do the charge wire upgrade. you need to have full 14 volts. 13 sounds pretty good but it aint shit when you need a lot of power for your amps. the alt is not nearly as efficient. it should never read 12 on your cap unless you had the car off for a while and stereo running. then you should turn on the car and see 14.9 to 15.1 immediately for a while then when the battery charges for a while then see it taper down to 14.3 or so.

 

my cap is my cars health meter. I guess you can call it a bandaid. more like a heart monitor.

 

Obviously you fail to understand the concepts at play here. A healthy electric system will not dip below the 12.6 volts stored by the battery. And Im fairly confident I never said a healthy electrical system can dip below 12 volts?

 

Your cap never needs to charge? Then you obviously cant comprehend what a capacitor does or how it operates. I suggest reading up on it so you will become properly educated. Read about capacitors from an industrial book, as most car audio enthusiasts fail to grasp it properly also.

 

Actually your best to leave the stock wiring. In high school science we learned electric will follow the path of least resistance. Therefore the stock wire will go unused.

 

And I have a typo in that post. A capacitor takes 3 time constants to discharge and 5 time constants to recharge. Its standard across all caps, period.