SteveH Posted April 5, 2008 Report Share Posted April 5, 2008 Ok I have some questions on a TGP that I'm interested in buying. What sort of problems should I look for with one. From what I have read some parts are hard to come by. Crossover pipe with bad bellows is one problem and what about the Turbo what could all go wrong with one. I really want to get this car, but I'm very wary on what it might cost to get it fixed. It would never ever be a daily driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krenzy Posted April 5, 2008 Report Share Posted April 5, 2008 Do yourself a favor, when you get free time to read it all, go to TGPForums.com, and under the "Problems and Solutions" topic, lookup "Grinders 18 Rolling Learning Thread"...this lists everything that has gone wrong on my personal car, and pretty much everything that can go wrong. Mine was a "worst case scenario" car, you know, the one's where everything that could have happened, did. There's also plenty of tips and instructions on how to replace the parts. If you get it, and the crossover is original, do the following: - COMPLETE tuneup - replace plugs, wires, ALL sensors - change the oil imemdiately - transmission filter change Frequent yourself on TGPForums and ask any questions you have...we're all friendly and here to help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2008 From the appearance of the car it looks like it was stored and has only 84k on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krenzy Posted April 5, 2008 Report Share Posted April 5, 2008 Appearances on these cars are VERY tricky. It might look fine, but carry a ton of problems. Get to know the owner if you can, find out the driving styles, what's been done, what it needs, and if the crossover was replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bake82 Posted April 5, 2008 Report Share Posted April 5, 2008 Check to make sure there are no brake lights on. The PM3(Power Master 3) brake master cylinder has a tendency to be tricky and cost alot to be replaced....no to scare you away...just something more to look for! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 My problem is I know very little about cars. Change the oil and put air the in tires. I never took auto shop in high school. :(What are the possible problems a turbo could have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted To Boost Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Steve, I sent you a PM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 84K on it, there shouldn't be TOO much wrong with it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Powered Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Im not afraid to buy any TGP. or afraid to drive one daily. It took me like 5 years to get used to working on one but with jeff m helping me with good advice I slowly got used to it and am not afraid of dash lights going off or anything. I just do the things that are guaranteed to be wrong with it and it keeps me out of trouble. and now its hard to spend more than a couple grand on them and they just keep going and going. Its almost like less is more, and the closer to stock you stay the more reliable it is. they are weird like that. the longer you own one, the better your luck will be. I just never let anyone touch my car anymore and thats how I have the best luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 What is a crossover and how do I know if mine is original? My engine runs very smooth and seems to have plenty of power to me at least. What can I do to check if the turbo is working correctly? I am also gonna check out the site mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Okay anyone have a picture of a crossover? Sorry for posting in this thread this is my last Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Powered Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 can you post a pic of your engine bay? get a pic of your turbo and where its piping comes over from the heads. if there is steel braiding on it then its good but smooth heatshield over it is stock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Appearances on these cars are VERY tricky. It might look fine, but carry a ton of problems. Get to know the owner if you can, find out the driving styles, what's been done, what it needs, and if the crossover was replaced. He bought the car from a car dealer. He has not had it that long. He knew the car was going to be at the car dealer and bought it right away. I know because I was interested in buying it. My brother thinks I should'nt get it that I will have trouble with the turbo on it. I want to at least look at the car, to see if it is in good shape and I still might buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 That's the original one that came on the car. If I'm not mistaken, but how can you tell if something is wrong with it? When the rubber cover is over it. It looks fine from the exterior but what about the inside of the crossover? So if I'm correct it has the rubber over it the heat shielding and then there is the crossover pipe and the bellows are inside? Click on the link and look for problems repairs and prevention and then under engine it is cracked crossover pipe. http://www.w-body.com/index2.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krenzy Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Well, first, Shadow, it IS original. It has the metal heat shield covering the stock pipe. And stock TGP crossovers will need to be replaced. I mean, I wonder at what mileage they first started going bad and the dealers thought to themselves "Hmmmmm, maybe they should have designed them better." To tell if there is something wrong with it, SteveH, remove it, and remove the protective metal covering. You will see the pipe and the little cracks on the stock bellows. While you have it out, send it to Kenny (TGPilot) to repair it, since it's already out and no one else to my knowledge does TGP replacement parts...Jeff M. dropped off the face of the earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted To Boost Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 The old crossover will have spring-like bellows like this: Pictured below is a crossover I refinished last spring. Notice the new braided bellows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Is the crossover easy to remove? It looks pretty difficult to me. My car passed emissions tests fine the other day. Only symtom I have from the list is poor fuel economy? Is it possible mine is good or someone replaced the oem heatshield? From my pictures it looks really hard to get to so do I have to remove alot of stuff to get to it? Thanks Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted To Boost Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 No, I doubt someone would go through the trouble of putting the heatshield back on. The crossover isn't terrible to remove.. provided you have tools to do it. You need to disconnect all the lines going to your turbo and remove your turbo first. Then you unbolt the crossover from the mount above the transmission (you will see it when the turbo is off) and then you unbolt the crossover from the headers. Thats just a quick write-up. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Also, you will need a stubby wrench to get one of the bolts on the bottom of the turbo to downpipe connection, I think they are 12mm but I don't remember for sure.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Powered Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 damn shadow, that looks pretty good. I have had a few crossover pipes that didnt leak too bad. truthfully there is other more important issues to address like lower mounts and struts and tranny filters, changing brake fluid, power steering fluid. unless you have smoke coming out the hood louver or smelling exhaust in the car you can get by for awhile. to get it off you need several long extensions and wobblys. its definately easier than it looks. thats when you can get to the dist. gear O-ring which you need before you do the lower mounts, so you might do it all at once. at the same time get a vacuum harness because they are cheap. just dont lose that vacuum clip you got on your TB there. those are kind of rare to see. but if you take off that heatshield (you have to basically drill out the spot welds), those bellows will crack for sure. they are fatigued from expanding and contracting. so if you take it off, just plan on getting it rebuilt. the heatshield will have black areas from exhaust leaking if its bad. but if its not leaking too bad, there is a chance if you are careful, to remove it and get to the o-ring and fix that leak and replace just so you can put on lower mounts. I have had to replace mounts once a year because the oil kills the rubber quick. mostly power steering fluid. it will dissolve the rubber and just hash it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Well, first, Shadow, it IS original. It has the metal heat shield covering the stock pipe. And stock TGP crossovers will need to be replaced. I mean, I wonder at what mileage they first started going bad and the dealers thought to themselves "Hmmmmm, maybe they should have designed them better." To tell if there is something wrong with it, SteveH, remove it, and remove the protective metal covering. You will see the pipe and the little cracks on the stock bellows. While you have it out, send it to Kenny (TGPilot) to repair it, since it's already out and no one else to my knowledge does TGP replacement parts...Jeff M. dropped off the face of the earth. I tried to leave a email to jeff m. and did'nt get a response. How much would Kenny (TGPilot) charge to fix the crossover? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krenzy Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Jeff is on a permanent vacation. He hasn't been around more than to check his messages in years. I think Kenny's are just over $300? Remember though, they will last the life of your vehicle, and you cannot just have someone weld one up for you; they need to use a special jig, to ensure that the welds don't break from the heat that these things endure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 So this would be the crossover pipe. Damn I was looking at the wrong thing. So it sits below the right upper motor mount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGP5sp90 Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Here's a picture of when I wrapped my exhaust, Along with crossover, during my 5 speed swap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted April 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Which pipe goes to the turbo on the crossover pipe the longer one or the shorter one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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