timg Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 My car is dirty, but here are some new pics. As you can see, the intercooler and BOV are in and it is running. The piping is not final- I'll be redoing it soon with help from a friend and probably sending the pipes off to be coated. http://home.bresnan.net/~tim_grady/wsb/html/view.cgi-photos.html-.html Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Nice, how much was that I/C and wherabout did ya get it? If you don't mind me asking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOHC_WBody Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Cool. I can already hear the 4T screaming for mercy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gp90se Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 I like I like, infact ill be doing the 3.4 turbo next month, have fun killin rice =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heza Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 aaaaahhhhh............oh so nice! but yeah, as NOHC_W-body said, the 4T will be crying. 4T60E-HD upgrade? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Thanks! My 4T60e was dying long before the turbo. With intake and exhaust, I was putting out between 175 and 180 hp from 5750-6750 rpm. That killed the 1-2 clutch packs pretty quickly. A stock 3.4 tends to fall off at high RPM and that was about a 25-30 horsepower gain at redline compared with the other dyno charts I've seen. Now with the turbo it's actually starting to feel better, but I know it's on its last legs. It'll slip completely out of gear every now and then and if I keep it floored between 1 and 2 it won't always shift. The intercooler is from http://www.adfxracing.com They list it under their DSM stuff. They sell it for something like $800, but I got it for about $450 off e-bay. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolt_Crank Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 oooo pretty! I want but I think I might do the 5 speed swap first.... but I don't know.... :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midstar Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 That is sweet. How much have you spent so far on your turbo venture? With my 4T60E it wouldn't even shift at 2/3 to full throttle. It would just beat off the limiter. And sometimes it would fall out of gear... a lot!! A 5 speed is the way to go. (It is just cooler anyways) 96 GTP 5 speed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeZ34 Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 A 5 speed is the way to go. (It is just cooler anyways) That's no joke.. The TGP is hella fun to drive with the 5 speed, which, I can only imagine how much more fun a turbo'd DOHC would be to drive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sl3196 Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 Hey do u live in larmie or gillette. I was wondering because your car is liscenced for campbell county. I live in gillette. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skalor Posted July 21, 2003 Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 Looks good!!! Can't wait to see some timeslips of what that beast will do. I noticed you used a 1st gen DSM bypass valve, good choice. I thought that they were open under all vacuum conditions though. So, it would be open at idle sucking in unfiltered air. Something to check out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 That is sweet. How much have you spent so far on your turbo venture? With my 4T60E it wouldn't even shift at 2/3 to full throttle. It would just beat off the limiter. And sometimes it would fall out of gear... a lot!! A 5 speed is the way to go. (It is just cooler anyways) 96 GTP 5 speed Pricing. Turbo 550 Wastegate 180 FMU 175 Piping 100 Gauges 150 Coating 100 Misc Plumbing 400 BOV 20 Intercooler 450 Mini-AFC 135 Fuel Pump 115 Install 500 Total 2,875 Yeah, the tranny is definitely an issue. Sometimes it shifts just fine (and hard), but other times it won't shift at all and I have had it fall out of gear a few times. I'm not quite sure if I want to rebuild it or replace it with a manual yet. It depends on when it blows and how much time and $$ each is. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 Hey do u live in larmie or gillette. I was wondering because your car is liscenced for campbell county. I live in gillette. I live in both. My parents are in Gillette and I'm staying with them for the summer. I have an internship with Kennecott. I still have a place in Laramie though and have one semester of college left. There are a few white Z34's around Gillette. You can tell which is mine because of the big tips (4 3.5" tips), spoiler, tint, mandsproduction.com stickers on the side rear windows, big tires, and lowered suspension. If you want to meet sometime, gimme a call at 680-0914. Next month it sounds like we're having a meet around Denver on the 30th and 31st. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 Looks good!!! Can't wait to see some timeslips of what that beast will do. I noticed you used a 1st gen DSM bypass valve, good choice. I thought that they were open under all vacuum conditions though. So, it would be open at idle sucking in unfiltered air. Something to check out I can't wait to see them either. Sometimes it feels VERY fast. The manual fan switch mod has definitely helped with consistancy, but my boost is still uneven between 5 and 8 psi. Tonight at 4500 ft, I was breaking the tires(245/50R16's) loose at 3-3.5k in first gear and having them spin for the rest of the gear! As far as the BOV, the DSM valve is awesome. It's just loud enough, cheap($20 plus a $13 flange), and it's holding all of the boost pressure just fine. As far as leaking at idle, I haven't had any issues so far. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ribbie Posted July 22, 2003 Report Share Posted July 22, 2003 So are you using the stock computer setup? Does the Vortech FMU compensate for the increase in boost? Cause I would hate to see you hit a lean situation. Just trying to understand the setup more as I am interested in the same type, if not I would go for an ATI Procharger setup. Which might or might not be easier. Hooking up a bracket that is in alignment with belt etc.... Thanks for your time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 22, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2003 So are you using the stock computer setup? Does the Vortech FMU compensate for the increase in boost? Cause I would hate to see you hit a lean situation. Just trying to understand the setup more as I am interested in the same type, if not I would go for an ATI Procharger setup. Which might or might not be easier. Hooking up a bracket that is in alignment with belt etc.... Thanks for your time. Hey, no problem. It's a 100% stock computer. My car is a MAF car so I could probably get by without the FMU IF my injectors could flow that much. I'm pretty sure the FMU is the only reason why the injectors aren't peaked out though. It's a 12:1 unit and I'm running pretty rich with it. I've been considering swapping bigger injectors and using the mini-AFC to tune for them. With something like that, you could replace the FMU entirely. Right now, the mini-AFC is in, but I haven't needed it to adjust the A/F ratio. If you do decide to boost, I'd highly recommend a turbo. If you're wondering why, check out the latest version of Hot Rod. They dyno'd a turbo, roots, and centrifugal blower on a built 5.0. The centrifugal made no boost at idle and it ramped up linearly to redline ie. 0 boost at idle (1000 rpm), 3 at 4000 and 6 at 7000 and linear in between. With the turbo, boost is independent of engine speed and you can make more boost everywhere. A good alternative supercharger is a Whipple. They're as efficient as a turbo or centrifugal, but make boost instantly and keep making boost all the way to redline. That would cost more for just the supercharger and the drive than I spent for my whole setup though. Any way you choose to go, I wish you the best of luck and if you have any more questions feel free to ask. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted July 23, 2003 Report Share Posted July 23, 2003 My car is a MAF car so I could probably get by without the FMU IF my injectors could flow that much. I'm pretty sure the FMU is the only reason why the injectors aren't peaked out though. Here is the thing, the MAF is only capable of reading so much air, once it hits the max it stops adding fuel. Also the ECM is only programmed to read so much air as well, it might be as much as the MAF can read or it may be lower. Sorry if you already know this but I don't want people thinking that MAF is god and can handle anything thrown at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 23, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2003 I know the MAF isn't perfect. The MAF charts I've seen are good for well over 500 hp and so I should never have a problem maxing out the MAF. However, the stock tables in the computer are something that I can probably max out. By that time, I'd definitely need new injectors though. The easy way to deal with that is with the mini-AFC like most of the GP guys do. It's incredibly well suited to boost and different injectors/MAF sensors, but it still is just a patch. When you're making that much power, fully programmable efi (stand alone or stock with heavy mods) is really the best way to go. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted July 23, 2003 Report Share Posted July 23, 2003 I'm thinking the ECM only recognizes up to 256 g/s (its the same way in the MAF vette motors). Hooking up a scantool to actually find out the readings would be nice. The MAF will probably read a great deal more air but the ECM is calibrated to focus on the 0-256 g/s portion only. The g/s variable is 16 bit, g/s = n / 256 g/s = 65535 / 256 g/s = 256 I'm not saying you are wrong, just trying to discourage the attitued that a STOCK MAF ECM will handle boost excellently. I've never looked into this mini-AFC before so i have no clue how well it will handle it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted July 23, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2003 You're completely correct. A stock MAF ecu will not handle boost perfectly. There are some drivability issues at part throttle that would not be present if a MAP reading was used. The MAF computer also hates blow off valves. So while it requires minimal tuning to make the system run well at WOT, it would take a lot to maintain stock driveability. Since I'm usually between floored and cruising, it's not a big trade off for me. For some other people, it definitely would be!!! The MAF sensor just outputs a frequency. The mini-AFC has settings every 1kHz from 1kHz to 13kHz. It will take the frequency at those points and alter it up or down by a certain percentage. What I was implying earlier is that assuming a linear relationship(there isn't one, but this is just an example) if you double injector size you can cut MAF frequency readings in half and double the horsepower the stock ECU is capable of handling. That's a pretty simplified way to describe it and relies on some very bad assumptions, but with larger injectors the AFC would be set to output a lower frequency than it receives and hence the stock computer would have extended range. Again, I'd better stress that this really isn't the safest or most reliable way to do it, but it might work very well and it is the cheapest in the short term. Brian has been right from the beginning in saying that the proper way to tune a turbo isn't with add on boxes, but with a fully re-mapped stock ECU or an aftermarket ECU. Tim Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleeperRed90TGp Posted July 25, 2003 Report Share Posted July 25, 2003 That turbo looks so big I would be afraid of it sucking my internals through the exhaust. Awesome. Jud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostnawd Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 sorry for dragging this post up from the depths, just wanted to say congrats on getting a turbo setup in there. turbos make anything... better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted August 27, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 sorry for dragging this post up from the depths, just wanted to say congrats on getting a turbo setup in there. turbos make anything... better! I agree, especially after making a Vette owner feel slow! Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 That turbo looks so big I would be afraid of it sucking my internals through the exhaust. Awesome. Jud TIM!!! WE WANT A KIT! WE WANT A KIT! WE WANT A KIT!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timg Posted August 28, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2003 there won't be a bolt on kit, but RedZmonte may be willing to sell you most of the parts. You'd still have to weld a oil return line onto the oil pan and get another front manifold. He's turboing his 3.4 DOHC this week and if you e-mail him at shane@mandsproduction.com he might build extra crossovers and downpipes. He can also sell you virtually every part you'd need. Be ready to spend $2k+ in parts for a basic setup though! Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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