timestalker45 Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 ok so the 3400sfi kills the 3.1mfi but whats better custom building a turbo charging system on a 3400sfi or upgrading to hire stage turbo on 3.1mfi turbo charged??? and which is a better way to go? mind all i have to still purchase a 3400sfi still, or try and find a 3.1mfi turbo depending on opinions i like other peoples thoughts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 well you'd have an easier time putting together a 3.1 MPFI since GM already did that. But the 3400 is a stronger block (cross bolted mains, priority oiling to the crank) and with the increased displacement, it will have more potential. Compression is a bit higher on the 3400 (9.5:1 ratio vs the 3.1's 8.8:1) and you'll have much more need for tuning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 the 3400 would make more power, and it would be easier to tune IMO since its already OBDII. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestalker45 Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 i was wondering if i can use my 3.1 multiport fuel injection set up (plentum, intake manifold, throttle botty) and use the 3.4 block also the 1990 3.1 mfi turbo did not have an obd2 in my opinion that system resrtics power not helps, as it stands my car does not have an obd2 and also after talking to preformance specialist i was told that yes the 3.4 is a good engine but they said if i went to it id have to change my transmission and the coversion to a 4t60-e would be a downgrade the 4t60 gives better response control and variation on shifting then a set transmission would, i was told the 4t60 would be a prefered racing transmission with the propper torq converter i just want the to use the bigger block and not have to switch my computer or tranny can that be done? or ideas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Sounds like the performance guy you are talking to has absolutely NO IDEA on anything with a computer or GM FWD for that matter. OBDII has such greater tuning capabilities over OBD I or no ecm in general. 3.1 heads, intakes, etc... on a 3400 block. It WOULD bolt up, but you would be seriously downgrading and removing tons of potential. the 4t60e has TONS more potential than the 4t60. Why go backwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supreme Cutlass Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 i was wondering if i can use my 3.1 multiport fuel injection set up (plentum, intake manifold, throttle botty) and use the 3.4 block also the 1990 3.1 mfi turbo did not have an obd2 in my opinion that system resrtics power not helps, as it stands my car does not have an obd2 and also after talking to preformance specialist i was told that yes the 3.4 is a good engine but they said if i went to it id have to change my transmission and the coversion to a 4t60-e would be a downgrade the 4t60 gives better response control and variation on shifting then a set transmission would, i was told the 4t60 would be a prefered racing transmission with the propper torq converter i just want the to use the bigger block and not have to switch my computer or tranny can that be done? or ideas Why in god's name would you even want to use the 3.1 intake?? that's the whole reason to swap to 3x00, and besides, no, you can't use the intake manifold on 3x00 heads, etc. Next, OBDII is MUCH more tunable with the proper tools compared to obdI, and is much more efficient when you're not flooring it. Why are you calling the 4T60-E a "set" transmission? The best part is that the shift points can be changed electronically. (of course I'm not sure of OBDII, but I know you have that option on OBD I custom performance chips) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Yes, on OBD II you can set the shift points anywhere you'd like. OBDII is far superior to OBDI. It's like comparing a foot powered vehicle to a jet (ok, not that bad, but still, soooo much better capabilities). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestalker45 Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 a 4t60 has no set shift points it veries on the throtle boddy, second the reason the obd2 can be tuined is do to the emsion set up and restrictions the older models (obd or ecm)have less goverment influence meaning the power is there just raw and a preformance chip from my understanding can double the power Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Absolutely untrue. Having the more sensors and more readings allows for more adjustments. I GUARANTEE you if you set up the exact same engine running on OBD I and OBDII and fully tune both, you will have better performance and better mpg with the OBDII. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supreme Cutlass Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Just look at the codes you find in comparing obd one and two. An OBDII code might read "P0104 Mass or Volume Air flow Circuit Intermittent" where OBDI is very vague and rarely throws a code unless something is way wrong, like "MEM-CAL error" OBDII is a much more advanced, and specific system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 I think you better learn about the GM FWD before you start trying to do anything with it IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestalker45 Posted July 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 ok what is there more to tune on an obd2? lets be honest all ur adjusting is thing being restricted by the obd system the computer is supost to limit toxic gasses duh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 oh good lord someone has brainwashed you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 ok what is there more to tune on an obd2? lets be honest all ur adjusting is thing being restricted by the obd system the computer is supost to limit toxic gasses duh Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 need I repeat myself? or better yet, let him do what he thinks he knows.... then when he cant get his OBDII motor tuned or messes it up to the point where it wont run... maybe then hell learn... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaloutsider Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 ok what is there more to tune on an obd2? lets be honest all ur adjusting is thing being restricted by the obd system the computer is supost to limit toxic gasses duh This was a joke.. right? .. right.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 I didn't swap to OBD2 for nothing. With a tuner, you can pretty much do whatever you want, even delete codes altogether and tuning it correctly, you can pass emissions with no cats. Can't do that with the old stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestalker45 Posted July 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 i live in new york we have emission restrictions so any tuneing that i would do are a lost point thats why a my inferior system (ecm) is ok i can get away with murder such if i update my engine and install an obd2 i have to have it pass an emission test. right now my car does not need to have one at all i polute the world with harmfull gasses and ok preformance on a crapy motor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairdo12 Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 In NY state, if your car is pre 96, it is subject to the pre 96 rules no matter what. The only computer check you need to pass is verification the check engine light works and does not stay on. All of your arguments are backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 Yeah, I'm from NY too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Regal Limited Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 ok moron, from my limited experience with CCC G-body's (not even as advanced as OBD 1 yet) is that there is an 02 sensor, and a mcs (mixture control solenoid, for AF ratio in the carb). Just using those 2 BASIC elements, with a tuner you can basically tell the computer that you want a 13:1 A/F ratio and it will be damn close to the 13:1 that you wanted, and also, you can control economy mixture based on sensor inputs from the car to get it running optimally and actually get decent gas mileage. OBD II (2) is much more advanced than that, because it uses FI, can control A/F ratios, Adjust shift points, and when not at WOT you don't get all 13:1 a/f ratio dumped in all the time, you get a more economy friendly fuel mixture until WOT. Computer guys, I'm basically right, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdelorie Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 i polute the world with harmfull gasses and ok preformance on a crapy motor and that, boys and girls, is the attitude that's wrong with this world these days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timestalker45 Posted July 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 1)how many have actually swaped a 3.1 multi port for the 3400sfi and did and obd2? 2)how many have actually owned a 3.1mfi pre 93 (93 has an ob1 and the 4t60-e) 3)have u ever noticed how much the older cars killed on hp and how now adays were pushing,pleading, and begging to get power out of these "better" engines 4)also its is required by state law if a car is modified no matter age to fit emission controls then it must pass them , second fine tuning= bs if u want a stable ilde yes but in the first place if the car was not recycling exuast fuems to burn off the left over carban then u wouldnt need to adjust anything, all ur doing is controling the fuel to air ratio, yes a bettter ratio means more gas milage, but in the end but back to the start the idea is to get the most oxygen to the piston the fastes and to have the spark on time. older car did this fine with no issues and had more power then cars today. Go figure no emissions no obd2 i used to race for a living fine tuning a car works on 1/0 prosses basic logic, now let me ask u the amount of pressure pushed froma single ignition is th logic or anilog i mean that ingnition is a variable its constenly changing computers and such things work on logice eather yes or no, open closed, 1/0. after having a tunible car that i had a on board labtop to adjust the air intake to pick three diffrent shift settings for my tranny, to moniter the psi and all my other sensors at the same time. u loose out on what is there to gain from power i had but stillt he response was sad odbd2 no matter how u set it is a restrictor its main purpose in life is to cut toxins all that exuast that goes out ur pipe is refined they turned the modern engine into a refinery for exhuast, so tell me how are u supost to get a true ignition on a dud system all thefresh air u take in get s mixed with fumes that arent refined enough. o2 sensor beside telling computer if exaust is to lean or rich lets computer no to adjust the eger valve and such to make sure the exaust is clean or as clean as possible. now im trying to start a argument all iw anted to know what was better 3.1 mfi or customizing a 3400 sfi, and every one made point as for how good the 3400 is but i wonder how much better it would be running on better oxygen and less fumes from the exuast also the 4t60 is an analog system works on true hydrolics do to throttle response no need to set shift points u control them by controling ur rpms incase no one knew that so if i can get back to the reason for the post the 3.4 block is a strong block but so is the 3.1 turbo now my q is can the intake manifold from3.1mfi be put on a 3.4 some one said yes i just wanted to verify i like my obd2 less way of life and i dont want to go switching harnesses and crap mfi system has hope but just not in the gas mpg area thats all i want to know form what i gathe the 3.4 should line right up with my 4t60 bell houseing and all correct i mean the 4t60-e has the same tor convert and desing? yes i know i prob missspelled like 80 things an ran on like 40 senstences but im not here to wina spelling B what gets me is that every one is so quik to upgrade to 3.4 sfi but what about a 3.4mfi why not no one has actualy seen what the out put would be gms doc was a mfi and it had major power despite the second over head cam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitaloutsider Posted July 17, 2007 Report Share Posted July 17, 2007 Let me ask you this, have YOU ever used an OBD-II tuner such as HPTuners or DHP PowrTuner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts