deafmetal Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Anyone here bought and installed the RSM big brake conversion kit into your Lumina? It's the kit that converts the front 10.5" to 13", and rear 10.5" to 12". Word is it'll also require 17" rims. A VERY pricey conversion, but for those who have experienced the Lumina's lack of stopping power with the 10.5" -vs- 3500 lbs, you know it's an worthwhile upgrade, just expensive ($1400 front, $1300 rear, then rims and rubber...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 It's WAY overpriced, IMO. That is a C4 Corvette brake system. C5 Corvette brake system is considerably far superior. I think you can get complete C5 Corvette front brakes (calipers, rotors, etc.) for less than $300 from GM Parts Direct. I could be wrong, but I think the $1100 you'd save over the RSM kit should be enough to get the rotors redrilled and a bracket welded to the knuckle to mount the new calipers. The C5 rear brakes are also far superior, because they no longer have the integrated park brake in the calipers. The park brake is a separate drum brake like the gen 2 W-bodies. I haven't priced this setup since I can't find part #'s for it, but again I think it wouldn't cost you more than $1300 including labor for any necessary welding and fabrication of brackets. Of course, I could be greatly underestimating the price of machining brackets and having them welded to your knuckles so I don't know. A C5 brake system is among one of my planned future projects though. I think I want to buy a Lincoln wirefeed welder and attempt it myself on my spare set of knuckles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted June 12, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Interesting idea!! I'll help find the part #'s and we can collaborate on a complete project listing if you want? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Sure, I have complete part #'s on the C5 front brakes at home. I'll post it tonight. I've even thought about a low-budget way to get the rotors on. The rotor BP is 5x120.5mm (or something like that) while ours is 5x115mm. Instead of having a machine shop redrill the proper bolt pattern, it should be possible to use a Dremel or something similar to elongate the holes. They'd only need to be elongated inwards about 2.5mm to fit. Since the rotor will be hubcentric with the center bore being exactly the same size, I don't think it will be a problem. The rotor will fit very snug on the center bore, and with the wheels clamping down on it, I doubt it could shift or pose any kind of safety hazard. That's just one thought I had, because it'll be hard for me to find a machine shop locally that would do this kind of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patgizz Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 i'm just looking at having a new thing made that welds to the knuckle im place of the stock one(you know that thing, between the spindle and where the hub bolts on and it accepts the caliper bracket). that is longer and would move the stock caliper out to accomodate bigger rotors. of course, the rotor would need to be the same thickness and depth off the hub as a stock one for this to work. was thinking 12" to keep it inside the 16" wheels. my buddy works at a CNC shop and i'm going to see if he can do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 C5 rotors are almost $100 each so its going to cost over $300 total. I read that the DIY C5 brake conversion for Camaro's cost about $650. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 C5 rotors are almost $100 each so its going to cost over $300 total. I read that the DIY C5 brake conversion for Camaro's cost about $650. Depends on where you get 'em. I buy my parts from Jason Cromer and he can sell 'em to me at close to what GMPD charges, but with much more reasonable S&H. It shouldn't cost $650 at all. I'll post a parts list with GMPD prices tonight. i'm just looking at having a new thing made that welds to the knuckle im place of the stock one(you know that thing, between the spindle and where the hub bolts on and it accepts the caliper bracket). that is longer and would move the stock caliper out to accomodate bigger rotors. of course, the rotor would need to be the same thickness and depth off the hub as a stock one for this to work. was thinking 12" to keep it inside the 16" wheels. my buddy works at a CNC shop and i'm going to see if he can do it. Where are you going to find 12" rotors of the same thickness and depth as the original? F-Body and Intrigue 12" rotors will both be 1.25" and more inset. All 97+ GM cars use 1.25" front rotors (including C5 'vette) while ours are 1", and I know for fact the Corvette rotors are more inset than ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Sweet. I know the RSM kit uses a spacer behind the rotor and the mounts for the caliper bracket are welded on the side of the strut knuckle. They are definately much more inset then ours are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toastemcutlass Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 those look like the rear calipers from an alero, what size are those? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Brian, You were right... it does cost a bit more than $300... I forgot to consider peripheral things like brake pads, pins, boots, lines, etc. Anyway, here's the list. I didn't add brake lines or pads to it since you can probably get those anywhere and we might need custom lines anyway. GM Description Unit Quantity Ext. Part # Price Price 88895128 Z06 LEFT FRONT CALIPER $83.81 1 $83.81 88895129 Z06 RIGHT FRONT CALIPER $83.81 1 $83.81 10445856 RIGHT FRONT ROTOR $50.00 1 $50.00 10445857 LEFT FRONT ROTOR $50.00 1 $50.00 12455799 FRONT CALIPER BRACKET $25.47 2 $50.94 10139097 GASKET $0.34 10 $3.40 (min order of 10) 12530697 PIN $3.30 4 $13.20 12530703 BOOT KIT $2.83 4 $11.32 22163795 FITTING $2.21 2 $4.42 Total: $350.90 GM Parts Direct adds almost $100 for shipping!!! I'm guessing Jason Cromer could sell all of this together for less than $400 shipped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Oh, your doing only the fronts. That explains it . The $650 I found was for front and rear for rotors and calipers only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Yeah, I couldn't find part #'s for the rear hardware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted June 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 For the other parts, keep in mind GM uses a sequential numbering scheme. So, since the front rotors are P# 10445856/7, I tried 8/9 and voolah!! http://www.auto-parts-for-less.com/ RR Rotor P# 10445858 LR Rotor P# 10445859 LR Caliper P# 88895130 RR Caliper P# 88895131 Rear Caliper Bracket P# 12455800 Will the stock master cylinder be able to push enough for the larger caliper pistons?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Good find on the rest of the stuff! I would just hope it's for the C5 and not some other car. The front caliper bracket p/n works for GMPD. The stock MC shouldn't be a problem. RSM doesn't change it for their C4 brake upgrade, and Baer's C4 brake upgrade for 97+ doesn't change the MC either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted June 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Ok Shawn, will use their site then, looks like they're cheaper than most anywhere else anyways... KEWL!! On a separate note: Dropped my car off this morning to have a tranny cooler installed. The guy called me back a few minutes ago asking why I wanted one. He said he has never installed one on a FWD car before, even though his shop is pretty reputable. He couldn't understand why I'd want one, and even when I explained my reasons, he kept trying to talk me out of it. WTF??? If the customer wants it, put it in... Pisses me off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted June 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Updated Z06 Brake Conversion Listing GM Part # Description Price Pkg Qty Qty Rqd Ext ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 88895128 Z06 LEFT FRONT CALIPER $83.81 1 1 $83.81 88895129 Z06 RIGHT FRONT CALIPER $83.81 1 1 $83.81 88895130 Z06 LEFT REAR CALIPER $61.01 1 1 $61.01 88895131 Z06 RIGHT REAR CALIPER $61.01 1 1 $61.01 10445856 RIGHT FRONT ROTOR $50.00 1 1 $50.00 10445857 LEFT FRONT ROTOR $50.00 1 1 $50.00 10445858 RIGHT REAR ROTOR $50.50 1 1 $50.50 10445859 LEFT REAR ROTOR $50.50 1 1 $50.50 12455799 FRONT CALIPER BRACKET $25.47 1 1 $50.94 12455800 REAR CALIPER BRACKET $25.47 1 1 $50.94 10139097 GASKET $0.34 10 ? $0.34 12530697 PIN $3.30 1 8 $26.40 12530703 BOOT KIT $2.83 1 8 $22.64 22163795 FITTING $2.21 1 4 $8.84 Total: $650.74 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gimp19 Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 You got one of the nicest lookin luminas I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted June 14, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2003 Thank You!! A LOT of blood, sweat, and tears just to finally see Chevy release the 2004 Monte supercharged.....lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted July 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2003 Bump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted July 9, 2003 Report Share Posted July 9, 2003 I dunno about you, but I haven't made any progress on this project. I'm in the process of an intermediate step of swapping in 96 knuckles. After that, I'll start playing with my original knuckles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deafmetal Posted July 10, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2003 Just put new pads on and flushed the fluid, etc... Can't afford this project yet, as it will cost an extra $1000 for rims and tires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegp Posted July 12, 2003 Report Share Posted July 12, 2003 $650 for an almost complete set of Corvette brakes -- boy do I really feel ripped off now! A couple of years ago I had the rear brakes done on my '89 gp at Sears. At the time, it was the only car I had that was running and I had no garage (it was winter) and I had a toddler. So, in other words, I couldn't do it myself. I really hate having to take my car to a garage and pay full retail for the parts and a crapload of labor! But to the point: I think I payed over $500 to have new crappy factory style stuff put on (rotors, pads, calipers). Right after that I got a letter in the mail about the lawsuit against GM for the W-Body rear brakes. The letter claimed that up to 80% of your repair costs would be reimbursed if you provided receipts. It took like a year, and I got back about $40. I guess they settled on a fixed sum and divided it up to everybody that sent in a claim. This is why I feel ripped off! Just thought I'd share that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted September 6, 2003 Report Share Posted September 6, 2003 Dragging this back up again Anybody happen to know the surface area of the C5 front pads? Also, why do you have to use the C5 rotors with their huge offset, I am sure there is another 1.25" thick rotor that has little offset like ours do then its just a matter of mounting a caliper. Worth investigating. And on the subject, i've been pondering how will 4 or 6 piston calipers will work on the stock larger 96 front brakes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted September 6, 2003 Report Share Posted September 6, 2003 You don't need to use C5 rotors, almost all GM cars have a 1.25" thick rotor these days. The only difference is the C5 is the only one with 13" rotors. The next biggest are 12". The C5 rotor offset is really not that huge, I think it has less offset than gen 2 W-body rotors. Either way you would need to be fabricating/welding caliper mounts, so the larger rotors just seem preferable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted September 7, 2003 Report Share Posted September 7, 2003 I was thinking along the lines of keeping my stock 16" wheels From pictures of the 97+ rotors and the C5, the 97 look to have less offset. Since my 5spokes are tucked under as it is (the crosslace's 1" extra in width is put on the outside of the mounting plane, the 5spokes are 1" tucked further in ) I was contemplating a 1/2 roughly behind the rotor depending on the 97 offset. Hopefully it will give enough clearance so that the strut knucle can be left alone and just a caliper adapter bracket could be used. It would also push my wheels out some to give the car a better look. You can get 97+ rotors up to 12" which i think is plenty acceptable. For the rear the C5 uses 1" thick rotors, just use either the stock 10.9 or 11.25 first gen front rotors back there and use a caliper bracket. I got bigger fish to fry first but I can't help but think about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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