Replacement Top Seals

[peeeot]

I contacted Metro Moulded Parts about their plans to reproduce the rubber parts for the convertibles. Here's part of their response:

 

"Thanks for your inquiry. I have looked into doing some weatherstripping

parts for the '90's Cutlass Supreme convertibles in the past, but

unfortunately the project has several strikes against it. One-they did not

make very many of these cars to begin with. Two-I have been unable to find

any original NOS (new old stock) parts to examine. And three-in the 1990's,

GM changed the weatherstripping parts on these cars so frequently we would

have to do multiple versions of the pieces to cover all the years instead of

one set of parts that fits them all.

 

In light of this, I still see a scenario where we might produce these parts

sometime in the future. However, we would need someone to find us samples of

the parts to examine before we could go any further. We would very much

prefer NOS samples, but extremely good used samples off of actual cars will

work as well. We would also need volunteers to test fit prototypes if we

were inclined to go forward on development. If you are interested in

discussing this further, please give me a call."

 

I've checked with a dealership, as they suggest later in the response, but as I'm sure most of you are aware, all the convertible-specific parts are just gone.

 

My header seal is splitting open and otherwise deteriorating, as are my windshield-door window seals. I get a little bit of water in because of these seals, and it would be nice to be able to replace them.

 

Does anyone have access to the parts needed for Metro to examine? I don't have any spares and mine aren't in good enough shape to use anyway.

[Crazy K]

I have plenty of bad condition spares....

 

any clue what the set would probably cost?

 

I don't think there were any actualy part changes as to all the ones I have seen... 91 to 95 at least.

[kendall221]

I do know that the front header seal changed once. Early versions of the '92 had version 1 of the seal and later '92s - 95 had version 2. Other than that, I don't know of any changes.

[peeeot]

That header seal change is what he specifically referenced. I don't know whether the seal was the same in '90 and '91 as it was in '92 though.

 

I don't have any idea how much such a set would cost. If it was all the top seals, I would guess somewhere between $100 and $300, but that's a pretty random guess.

 

here's what he said about it:

 

"FYI-the weatherstripping parts are all the same for 1993

through 1995 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme convertibles. Most of the 1992 parts

will work as well (just not the header seal). "

 

 

[DOHCRagtopguy]

Man, you would think that one of those suppliers would jump on this.

 

It's an untapped market, there's some money just waiting to be made.

 

I'd gladly pony up some bread for a completely new set of seals for the top.

[OSVHURST/OLDS]

yeah I agree, if any company would start reproducing any of the vert specific parts there would be alot of money for them as DOCHRagtopguy said its an untapped market, that you would think some company would jump on. I would aslo gladly pony up money for replacement seals

[kendall221]

Actually, I've been doing some research for you guys, and some of the weatherstrip parts are still available. I've gotta go to my son's basketball game, but will post the information that I have pulled together here within the next day or so. Since I used to have one of these cars, I sympathize with you guys for having trouble finding parts. I currently have the same problem with finding parts for a '95 Ford Thunderbird Super Coupe.

 

Will get back later,

 

David

 

 

[kendall221]

Ok, Here's some part numbers for the big front weatherstrip seal for the header bow. There are 3 different part #s as follows:

 

90 - 91 - #12503923

92 - #12517023 (1st design that has diagonal step on outboard corner)

92 - 95 - #12521618 (2nd design that has round step on outboard front corner)

 

So far, the only one that I have found available is the 92 (first design). If you have the 2nd design, you can't just go and change to the first design without also changing the mating weatherstrip seal that this seal comes up against at the top corners of the windshield. Otherwise you will have leak problems. I have verified that you can order this part from http://www.partszoneonline.com, and they want $196.62.

 

I have 2 parts books for '88 - '97 Cutlass Supremes. One of them has the '90 - 92 convertible parts list, and the other has '92 - '95. The '92-'95 is on microfiche, while the earlier is in a 3 ring binder. I plan to post all of the weatherstripping part #s here online in a Word document, and include a picture from the parts book with an exploded diagram.

 

I have also searched for the bottom outside seal for the rear quarter window. So far, I have not been able to find any, but am still searching a couple sources where I have previously found discontinued parts.

 

Of course, as most of you already know, these parts are discontinued, so finding any of them is very "hit or miss".

 

David

 

 

[peeeot]

Wow, thanks David!

 

Those part number listings and diagrams you mentioned would be really helpful. I was wondering where you got those part numbers from.

 

I haven't encountered that particular site before. I just entered those three part numbers on there and it provided a listing for the 2nd design as well: $194.61. Also it lists the 1st design for $184.53. Did you call them to get the price/availability you posted about?

 

It says that the part number you listed for the earliest strip is non-existent.

 

I wonder what the difference is between the '92 and the earlier cars. Mine is a '91.

 

I suppose if those other windshield seals could be obtained, it wouldn't matter.

 

 

[kendall221]

I sent them an email last night with part numbers, and they responded back saying that the only one available was the 92 (first design). I'm not sure what the difference between this and the earlier version (i.e. '90 - '91) is. I did have a '92, and it had the first design, so if you take a picture and post it, then I could probably tell you if it would fit. The difference is in the corners where the top seals with the windshield header (at the latches). Apparently, the first design had a diagonal corner, and the 2nd design was rounded. at least that's how its explained in the parts books. It would also be helpful if someone would post a picture of the '93-95 header seal so we could look at it also.

 

I got the parts books on Ebay about 5 to 6 years ago. The hardcopy parts book has a 1992 date on it (has '88-92 parts), and the microfiche has a '99 date on it ('92 - '97 parts).

 

In the past, I have found that the online parts books have information and prices in them that may not be totally up to date. It may show it being available and have a price for it, but when you order it, you just might get an email back saying the part is not available. That's why I sent an email asking if they were actually available.

 

David

 

[dhs1223]

I would definitely by in for any kind of group buy if we can get something going. I have a used (but in good condition) front header seal for the windshield frame taken from a 1995 vert found in a junk yard as well as the 2 shorter seals for the tops of the rear windows.

 

I would be willing to provide them as samples to someone like Metro Moulded Parts if we want to take this that far.

 

I think we all should look seriously at this and have this developed by someone before we loose any chance of having good usable parts available. I plan on owning my car for many years and I hope there is enough of us vert owners that want to insure that we can get what we need for our cars in the future.

 

Can anyone suggest other vert specific parts that we as a group should consider having reproduced?

 

l think that our group of vert owners should take the lead in preserving this car.

 

[Crazy K]

good work guys! keep the info coming!

[Psych0matt]

all seals all around would be good things to have repros of, as well as the top part of the windshield, the little cups and such, rear drain thingy (behind the rear seats), etc

[Fmr12B]

I would absolutely purchase a new set of seals. The ones I need most are the seals around the base of the rear windows. From what I've seen almost all cars have these chunked away.

 

The front window seals and windshield seal seems fine as of now but putting money down on a set would not be a problem if they were to be made.

 

Last set of exteriror lower rear window seals in a GM parts bag went for around $200 on ebay about a year ago. If they would produce them they could sell them through a number of outlets and recoup their tooling costs pretty quick.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[peeeot]

Okay, here are pictures of the windshield header seal and top corners of the windshield from my '91. I have some blue silicone on the corner of the windshield to prevent leakage, so it might be a little hard to tell what you're looking at.

 

http://thewolfweb.com/photo_photo.aspx?user=21299&photo=476138

 

http://thewolfweb.com/photo_photo.aspx?user=21299&photo=476139&filter=

[kendall221]

The best that I can remember (it's been 4 years now since the car was wrecked), the corner looks the same. When I replaced the top, I did take some video of the old top, so let me see if I can find it and maybe I got a closeup of the corner.

[dhs1223]

I hope this thread doesn't die, we need to keep on top of this, compile a complete set of good samples and find someone to reproduce these items for us.

 

As I mentioned, I have 3 of the seals (used but good) that I can contribute, but I would like there to be a committment by at least 10 people to buy a complete set of vert top seals if we can get them made.

 

Please sign in if you would want to be part of this project.

 

Thanks

[DOHCRagtopguy]

Count me in for sure! Gotta have those rear window quarter seals too.

[dhs1223]

DOHCRagtopguy

 

I have been wondering for a while, where did you get your "new" top, or who made your new top. It is nice to see a top other than black or white or tan. How were you able to select the color, etc.

 

Thanks

 

[Fmr12B]

Has anyone contacted Year One?

 

They have created the molds of lots of different cars and stock a ton of seals, moldings, and surrounds. Perhaps they would be interested in taking up this cause?

[DOHCRagtopguy]

DOHCRagtopguy

 

I have been wondering for a while, where did you get your "new" top, or who made your new top. It is nice to see a top other than black or white or tan. How were you able to select the color, etc.

 

Thanks

 

 

I got it done at some shop on Bustleton Avenue in Philly. He showed me a whole bunch of samples, but I don't remember who the hell made it. It's a cloth top, not vinyl.

 

I know that you can find the same top on line. Just do a search for convertible tops and you will find it eventually.

 

I wanted to have something different and I kind of liked the color combination.

 

My poor Olds has been pressed back into everyday driving because the throwout bearing on my Nissan 200SX took a shit. I had to drive it in the snow the other day, I kept on apologizing to her for putting her thru that.

 

I just got my Nissan parts today, so hopefully I can put my baby back into the nice warm salt-less garage until warm weather comes again.

 

Sorry I don't have any more info for ya on the top.

[peeeot]

Metro Moulded is the only company I've contacted. As far as I can tell, they deal exculsively in the fabrication of rubber parts, especially automotive weatherstrip. I think Year One and many other vendors probably sell Metro seals.

 

I certainly would like to see this project through. I don't have the money for a complete set right now (too much tied up in my other car) but that could very well change by the time the process is over with. My car is a '91, though, so if I have to use a different set of seals, I won't be interested in a set that won't fit.

[Crazy K]

So... If I understand all this... The seals have specific cuts where they join the next piece... Could the newer type seals replace the older type if the header and midsection seals are replaced as a set???

 

Which would mean they should just make a new seal set based on the latest molding design, and intended to replace the entire old design as a set?

 

 

[dhs1223]

I hope you are correct in your assumption that a complete set would fit on any year of vert. If that would be the case, then just one type would have to be reproduced. I am assuming that the later version would be the better design as the car went through minor revisions during its production span.

 

Like I said, I have a few pieces that I would be willing to provide as samples for evaluation by a manufacturer. I guess we need to find out how many companies would be willing to look at this and get some firm price quotes.

 

Let's keep this going, I think we will all be happy if we can pull this off. Preservation of these cars should be our priority. These cars still look so good on the road and I want to be able to maintain my car for as long as possible, and that will mean replacing certain parts over time.

 

Thanks guys.

 

[peeeot]

The windshield pillar weatherstrip would have to be reproduced in addition to the top header seal in order for the later parts to work on an older car. I don't know whether there were any changes in the windshield reveal mouldings at all (the black painted parts, to clarify) but if there were that could cause issues.

 

I hope that all seals mount the same way, such that the later seals could be replaced as a set on the earlier top frames and windshield frames. We'd just have to compare them side-by-side. I wonder, though, why Metro would worry about having to make 3 different sets if any one set could be substituted in for the others (i.e., the only thing different between any year is the soft seal itself). It's not like people are doing concours restorations on these things at this stage.