My Cutlass Project. HOMGZ! (Carnage pics; btm of page 4)

[digitaloutsider]

Well, I'm currently torn between two possible projects:

 

A Turbo STE 5-speed (ala. OldSkoolGP but with an LG5)

 

or

 

Project Cutlass Revival (Junk my shell, get a nice one, swap my parts over)

 

With this Cutlass project though, what I've been thinking about doing is swapping in the LX5 3.5 DOHC Shortstar. I love the feel of a DOHC motor, and I personally don't want anything to do with an L67 swap. Along with the Cutlass project comes an OBD-II swap so all the difficulties of controlling the engine are pretty much eliminated. There are factors I can't forsee such as flexplate compatibility with the 284. I like the LQ1, don't get me wrong, but I'd prefer something much more unique and refined. This car will most likely be a show car since I need/want a good hobby to keep me busy. I think a judge seeing a shortstar shoved under the hood of a first-gen would win a few shows

 

I'm a bit surprised at the low redline of the Shortstar. How is top end power? Low end grunt? Any big maintenance issues? I know Irondog loves to brag about the reliability of the motor, I hope he's right. I've heard about main seals (i think that's what it was) giving way.

 

I'm also concerned with fitment. The LQ1 is a large motor, but the LX5 looks even bigger. Has anyone ever considered moving to the LX5? Any data on this motor would be great. It's difficult to find much of anything about it. So, really. What do you guys think? Use the Shortstar? Should I even do the Cutlass project or do the TSTE? Opinions!

[digitaloutsider]

New thought: The M90 looks like it'd be right at home between the banks of the LX5...

[IRONDOG442]

I am not sure you can pigeon hole a LX-5 assembly into a generation I w-body, But I think this is a great idea and yes GM already has already supercharged the shortstar and the lower end is strong enough for a ton of boost. If you put it together and don't like it, I will buy it from you.

[digitaloutsider]

You know, the more I think about this, the more I like the idea of a Supercharged LX5. Except I like it a lot more in the Regal.

[digitaloutsider]

[slick]

THe LX5 won't fit in a Gen1 without some serious modification.

[digitaloutsider]

What are some fitment issues you know of?

[99RegalGS]

Someone put a N* in a 1.5 gen. so I'm sure you could put a LX5 in a 1st gen also.

 

And Shaun, keep the LQ1!!!!!

[digitaloutsider]

LQ1 is going to see the trash heap if I can fit the LX5 in. lol. Get in the W-body chat.

[slick]

What are some fitment issues you know of?

 

Well... you've personally seen the LQ1 fitment. The LX5 is MUCH wider.

 

Someone put a N* in a 1.5 gen. so I'm sure you could put a LX5 in a 1st gen also.

 

IIRC, the engine bays are a bit different from the 1.5 gens to the 1 gens. I believe its the firewall.

[Crazy K]

IIRC, the engine bays are a bit different from the 1.5 gens to the 1 gens. I believe its the firewall.

They seem to use the same hvac unit. and 95-97? have the same frame IIRC. 98?+ have larger bolts?

 

unless the firewall is actually just offset back a bit? The wiper area is different, the gen 1's wiper area sticks forward with a large overhang. otherwise should be the same. difference might just be an inch or so?

[digitaloutsider]

Just measured it:

 

Regal:

Fenderwell to fenderwell: 55 inches

Radiator support to the farthest point back on the firewall: 35.5 inches

 

Cutlass:

Fenderwell to fenderwell: 54 inches

Radiator support to the farthest point back on the firewall: 33.5 inches

 

While there MIGHT be a small fitment issue on the front to back, you can't tell me width is an issue here.

[jeremy]

I would drive a LX5 powered car before even considering an attempt at swapping it in an option.....

[slick]

I meant the front to back. For some reason, I think that down near the head area of where an engine would sit, the 1.5 gens are pushed back a bit more. I coulda swore I read this somewhere.

[Dirty Rockstar]

I want to do an LX5 like no one's business.. But my issue comes to play in a few areas:

 

I was "scared" by the fitting of the LX5 in my engine bay.. Shaun, I think you should go measure your LQ1, from the 2 furthest points front to back, and then someone on here with the LX5 (I thought for some reason Irondogg had the 3.5 in his 0x Aurora, but I could be wrong..

 

..Like I said, I would LOVE to shove one of these into my car, turbo it, and have it that way..

 

If it fits, guess what engine I am gonna do as well?! lol

 

EDIT: The blown LX5 is the sex.. Saved to disk!!

[digitaloutsider]

I would drive a LX5 powered car before even considering an attempt at swapping it in an option.....

 

We had a 3.5 Intrigue as a rental car for a few days. I know it was faster than the automatic LQ1's I've driven.

 

I've been talking to Irondog about this quite a bit. In fact, that's where I got the pictures from! I'll ask him tomorrow if he has any measurements.

[GP1138]

Sounds like a really cool project, Shaun. Keep us updated.

[digitaloutsider]

Yeah. I've officially decided on this. This is going to be my project car. It will unravel over the next year or two.

 

What I have decided on so far:

 

The theme is "Concept car that GM didn't crush".

Dismantle my Cutlass. Remove EVERYTHING. Crush the shell.

Getting a 90-94 Cutlass Supreme donor car. Preferably white. Moonroof is required.

If it doesn't already have it, add the 92+ trim, including miniquads and lip tails.

It's getting the LX5, and damnit, I'm going to bolt a blower to it. This IS a show car.

The 284 is staying. Without a doubt.

Trying to decide between the Intrigue OSV show car candy apple red or pearl white.

Put OSV badges in place of International badges (minus the one on the hood, that one is ugly).

 

That's all I've got so far. I AM building this car. This is my dream, and damnit, I'm going to live it.

[nebojsa_o]

Well, sound like a pretty big project. Good luck with that, and take lots and lots of pictures. And when I say, take, I also mean post them for us to see. It's gonna be a big project, but deffinitly cool!

[digitaloutsider]

Yeah. I wish I could somehow see how GM bolted that blower to the LX5. It has no lower intake manifold. This is how it looks under the plenum:

 

[Dirty Rockstar]

I wish someone would measure that monster!

 

Shaun, go ahead and add me to your AIM list: Stevezasycho.. We can help eachother out getting it in there.. I am ready to get it in there NOW as I am dismantling the whole car (THe interior is gone, and the 3.1/3speed is next..)

 

..I've never driven an LX5, but the way a DOHC V6 feels, I can only imagine HOW it runs..

 

..When you say "tons of boost" Irondogg, how much are we talking? Because I might just Turbo it instead..

[IRONDOG442]

Yes my 01 Aurora has an LX-5 too and they seem to run stronger with dual exhaust, for some reason the Aurora seems quicker and its a heavier car. I can't imagine it being just the exhaust but maybe its because that car only has 14,000 miles on it and my other car has 100,000. I can measure the motor for you next time I am out at the shop.

 

My vote is for the candy apple red, by the way I missed owning this car by $10. I still have it in my must acquire list and will probably end up with it at some point.

 

[attachment deleted by admin] Removed to free up storage space.

[slick]

Yeah. I wish I could somehow see how GM bolted that blower to the LX5. It has no lower intake manifold. This is how it looks under the plenum:

 

 

Custom plenum will have to be made, or else remote mount the SC.

 

IMO, it's much easier to tune a turbocharged engine than an sc'd engine that never had any form of boost before.

[jeremy]

We had a 3.5 Intrigue as a rental car for a few days. I know it was faster than the automatic LQ1's I've driven.

 

I've been talking to Irondog about this quite a bit. In fact, that's where I got the pictures from! I'll ask him tomorrow if he has any measurements.

 

oh...the way I read it was that you had never driven one....on the other note, true or not, I do not know for sure, but I have a hard time believing that a factory LX5 Intrigue is quicker then an LQ1 powered w-body. Stock LQ1 autos tested out around 15.4-15.5 in the 1/4 mile when new and I don't recall Intrigues beating that time in stock trim. They may have, but I have never seen it.

 

I certainly am not trying to start an LQ1 vs. LX5 debate, I have driven and like both engines. I think that swap would be very nice and Irondogg is a GREAT oldsmobile information source. That being said, asking his opinion of and LX5 vs LQ1 is the exact polar opposite of asking Aaron his opinion of the same.

 

Best of luck with the project and when you start it you need to do a complete build up thread

[digitaloutsider]

Custom plenum will have to be made, or else remote mount the SC.

 

IMO, it's much easier to tune a turbocharged engine than an sc'd engine that never had any form of boost before.

 

True, but engine bay space is at a minimum already. If I was going the turbo route, I'd probably keep the LQ1. But I was talking to Sean in the W-body chat last night, and what I want is a car that looks like something GM would produce. A turbo looks really "rat-rod", IMHO and it doesn't look like something GM would do themselves.

 

I don't see tuning being that big of a deal overall, especially with OBD-II. A problem I DID see is that neither HPTuners nor DHP PowrTuner "supports" the LX5. If I can't use a tuner, that's going to bring this project to a screeching halt.

 

Hopefully I'll have the car and engine sourced by April. The blower and TB is cake to find. I'll see if I can find a wrecked Intrigue and buy the whole thing, since I need so many parts pertaining to the engine itself. We'll see where we go with this. Any other comments and suggestions?