2nd Gen front suspension on a 1st Gen car?

[OldSkoolGP]

I'm trying to come up with the ultimate handling pack for 1st Gen cars and that may mean sourcing parts from some Gen 1.5 Gen 2 cars. The biggest thing I'm trying to overcome is restoring proper handling once you lower a car. If you use lowering springs now, your control arms end up sitting level, which is bad because then when you go to corner it pulls the outside tire in and your contact patch becomes the outside edge of the tire only. So I need to figure out how to either get a longer A-arm in there that moves the ball joint out, or ideally something that moves the ball joint lower to restore the proper A-arm angle. That way when you corner you're using all of your contact patch.

 

Has anyone ever tried to put 2nd gen front spring and hub assemblies on a 1st Gen car? I'm wondering if the 2nd gen assemblies are taller, or if they would work at all. Also I'm wondering if the A-arms are different in length, preferably longer than 1st Gen A-arms. If someone has some apre 2nd Gen parts lying around that they'd be willing to do some measurements for me I'd greatly appriciate it.

 

[5speedz34]

I can help you out. I got a set of 97 Monte Carlo Z34 strut assemblies in the garage. As for the second gens the strut assemblies are very different.....

[99RegalGS]

[Crazy K]

gen 1.5 and gen 1 front suspension are the same.

 

[pwmin]

that's what i thought, crazy

 

 

what measurements do you want? im going to change the oil in my mom's 01 on a lift and i can probably take some measurements.

[99RegalGS]

Yesterday Josh Looked at my car to compare. The front suspension is wayyy different on 2nd gen's. The Rear suspension looks very similar though (besides the spring differences).

 

I have pics. I'll post them up later.

[5speedz34]

Yesterday Josh Looked at my car to compare. The front suspension is wayyy different on 2nd gen's. The Rear suspension looks very similar though (besides the spring differences).

 

I have pics. I'll post them up later.

 

Yeah, thats pretty much right.

[GnatGoSplat]

This has been discussed before. Gen 1.5 are the same, but Gen 2 are completely different. Don't let the fact gen 2's were still called "W-body" fool you, they're completely different. There was someone attempting to do a gen 2 conversion on a gen 1.5, but it required a lot of cutting, welding, and fabrication. Pointless IMO, because that kind of cutting, welding, and fabrication could get you a lot better than gen 2 hardware.

 

[OldSkoolGP]

You could do it that way. The easiest way I think you be to use a Gen 2 aluminum cradle as your base, everything should still bolt in and it would be a bit lighter. What I did learn is the Gen 2 front end is unusable for me with a manual. Plus, I just don't trust that knuckle on the front of the Gen 2 A-arms. However, the rear suspension shows a lot of prosmise. I'm going to play around with some thing on my car in the coming weeks to see what parts I can use. I think it holds some promise. In the mean time, if anyone has heard of someone that makes poly bushing for the Gen 1 fron end that isn't RSM, let me know.

[GnatGoSplat]

Gen 2 cradle doesn't bolt into a gen 1 at all.

 

[99RegalGS]

Josh, here are the 2nd gen "race" control arms I meant to show you last weekend.

 

http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/w-body-store-race-ready-control-arms-p-156.html

 

BTW here are the pics finally loaded up:

http://gsregal.jbarbieri.net/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=347

[pwmin]

why do you say the rear shows promise? i think the suspension on the 1st gens is a better design. they sure handle better stock for stock than a 2nd gen.

[99RegalGS]

I disagree. My old 1st gen Regal vs my new 2nd gen Regal. Both were stock. My New Regal is wayyyyy better in the handling department then my old Regal.

[pwmin]

are there any stock for stock comparisions say as GPG on the autox course?

 

i know my mom's 01 sped feels like its going to roll a lot more than mine ever did. the monoleaf is much more stable. why do you think corvettes use them?

 

ah, fuck it, im not going to argue. sorry for the hijack.

[OldSkoolGP]

Nah, it's debateable. What I'll say is the monoleaf spring they use in the Corvette is WAY stiffer than anything on a W-body. Besides, the leaf spring on a Corvette is a lot like the rear engine on a Porsche 911. Everyone agrees it's the wrong way to do it, but when you've had 50 years to play with it you make it work, and work well.

 

The downside of the 1st Gen suspension is those lousy control arm made of stamped steel. They have way to much flex in them and they aren't adjustable. The 2nd Gen rear control arms fartherest back are solid tubes and have adjusters built on to them. They should bolt right in to a 1st gen setup, and using them fore and aft will not only give you toe control but camber control, huge if you like to take corners. Add in the GMPP trailing arms, and you've got a much better handling rear end. I'm going to put these parts and the Addco sway bar on mine and see how well it works, and I'm expecting good things.

 

Thoretically, you could bolt the entire Gen 2 rear suspenion into a Gen 1 while still being able to use the Addco rear sway bar if you really wanted to, and that would give you springs in the back without having to get a coilover spring kit from FFP or Held. Someone else can try that, I'm still using my Gen 1 hubs.