Got and Alignment done, have some questions

[5speedz34]

So I replaced the tie rods on my sisters car on Sunday. It pulled pretty hard to left before and it still did after the tie rods got installed. NAPA has a deal with the local Goodyear Retailer that if you buy the parts through them and take it to Goodyear they give you 25% or something off a 4 wheel alignment.

 

Now, the car has 245/50/16's on it (don't ask came with the vehicle) and the service writer was telling me they might have trouble since the tires are so big, etc. We'll they aligned it but they couldn't set caster on the drivers side he said w/o pulling the strut tower. Caster is this:

 

 

This does make sense but I've never heard of this before. He said it may still pull but to adjust that they would need to pull the strut tower. Does this make sense. Also, theres no real way to adjust the rear on these cars are there?

 

I'll post the alignment sheet later, ohh and they offered me a job.

 

Read about alignments here: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=4

[Crazy K]

post the sheet.

 

every time camber has been off on my cars, it is because the control arm has shifted and the mounting tangs are kncoked crooked some... or alot. I'd look carefully and see if the offending side looks like the flanges are offset. if they are, loosen the bolts and flex them straighter till they appear correct and have the alignment re-checked. I did this on my Lumina and drove it for the rest of it;s life this way.

[GutlessSupreme]

I don't believe that caster is adjustable on these cars, short of bending something. Rears aren't adjustable either.

 

 

Most places around here don't check anything except toe.

[19Cutlass94]

I duno about that. I took mine to the local Olds dealer to get it aligned, and they give you a print out sheet of the actual camber, toe, and caster, and then what the spec is suppose to be i.e. the range for each. I have it, and Ill try to find it.

[19Cutlass94]

Well I found it:

 

I can give you the geometry from when my car got an alignment, I hope itll help.

 

 

Both Left and Right FRONT Camber, Caster, Toe have the same specified range,

Camber - +0.2 to +1.2 degrees

Caster - +1.5 to +2.5 degrees

Toe - -0.10 to +0.10 degrees

 

Total for FRONT specified range

Cross Camber - -0.8 to +0.8 degrees

Cross Caster - -0.8 to +0.8 degrees

Total Toe - -0.20 to +0.20 degrees

 

 

Both Left and Right REAR Camber, Toe have the same specified range,

Camber - -0.4 to +0.6 degrees

Toe - -0.20 to +0.10 degrees

 

Total for REAR specified range,

Total Toe - -0.40 to +0.20 degrees

Thurst Angle - -0.15 to +0.15 degrees

 

 

 

 

Hope this helps!

 

 

 

Still trying to find the sheet with what my actual measurments were...

[5speedz34]

 

That's what they gave me. You can see the left caster isn't within spec.

[blackbombshell95]

If you are talking about a Gen I wbody then front and rear caster isn't adjustable at all. Front camber is adjustable by enlongating the strut tower holes. And the rear camber is barely adjustable unless you also enlongate the lower strut bolt hole. Toe on front and rear is adjustable. Rear toe is non essentric.

 

That is how my 95 Grand Prix is. I've done about 4 or 5 alignments on it.

[blackbombshell95]

Did they forget to adjust your right rear toe???

 

Your front caster is barely out of spec. That is fine. Maybe some of your bushings are worn or something. Caster does not cause tire wear. Actually more positive caster is better for high speed driving. You will notice that performance cars have lots of positive caster.

[Brian P]

that is barely off, I wouldnt worry about that.

[5speedz34]

Well, the thing it still pulls. I'm not worried about tire wear, I just don't like it pulling.

 

I thought there is no way to adjust the rear end?

[Brian P]

pulling is more likely to be from an unevenly worn set of tires. Since toe was off up front (for how long?) the #'s aren't too far off, but both are negative, so they were going against each other. Maybe try a rotation and see if that helps. Also check for a sagging drivers side spring. My car has a slight pull to the left, and has been there even after tire changes, steering rack changes, many alignments, etc (not intended to fix the pulling problem, but for other reasons) the front left of my car sits a touch lower than the front right. Something to check into.

[5speedz34]

pulling is more likely to be from an unevenly worn set of tires. Since toe was off up front (for how long?) the #'s aren't too far off, but both are negative, so they were going against each other. Maybe try a rotation and see if that helps. Also check for a sagging drivers side spring. My car has a slight pull to the left, and has been there even after tire changes, steering rack changes, many alignments, etc (not intended to fix the pulling problem, but for other reasons) the front left of my car sits a touch lower than the front right. Something to check into.

 

Well, what sucks is this isn't my daily driver, and my sister a ungrateful bitch that after all this time that she bitches that now I take time to get it fixed, that its too long for her to wait.

 

With that said. It has pulled since we bought it. The tires honestly didn't look worn to me any time I've had them off. I haven't checked for spring issues. Since when do those go bad though?

[Brian P]

pulling is more likely to be from an unevenly worn set of tires. Since toe was off up front (for how long?) the #'s aren't too far off, but both are negative, so they were going against each other. Maybe try a rotation and see if that helps. Also check for a sagging drivers side spring. My car has a slight pull to the left, and has been there even after tire changes, steering rack changes, many alignments, etc (not intended to fix the pulling problem, but for other reasons) the front left of my car sits a touch lower than the front right. Something to check into.

 

Well, what sucks is this isn't my daily driver, and my sister a ungrateful bitch that after all this time that she bitches that now I take time to get it fixed, that its too long for her to wait.

 

With that said. It has pulled since we bought it. The tires honestly didn't look worn to me any time I've had them off. I haven't checked for spring issues. Since when do those go bad though?

 

Steel springs? Just as they wear out. At least they won't break like the N-body crowd.

 

Your sister sounds like she acts just like mine. In that case, rotate the front tires left to right, if it still pulls left, add 2-3psi on the left and drop 2-3psi on the right done, goodbye bitch

[5speedz34]

pulling is more likely to be from an unevenly worn set of tires. Since toe was off up front (for how long?) the #'s aren't too far off, but both are negative, so they were going against each other. Maybe try a rotation and see if that helps. Also check for a sagging drivers side spring. My car has a slight pull to the left, and has been there even after tire changes, steering rack changes, many alignments, etc (not intended to fix the pulling problem, but for other reasons) the front left of my car sits a touch lower than the front right. Something to check into.

 

Well, what sucks is this isn't my daily driver, and my sister a ungrateful bitch that after all this time that she bitches that now I take time to get it fixed, that its too long for her to wait.

 

With that said. It has pulled since we bought it. The tires honestly didn't look worn to me any time I've had them off. I haven't checked for spring issues. Since when do those go bad though?

 

Steel springs? Just as they wear out. At least they won't break like the N-body crowd.

 

Your sister sounds like she acts just like mine. In that case, rotate the front tires left to right, if it still pulls left, add 2-3psi on the left and drop 2-3psi on the right done, goodbye bitch

 

Actually she probabky wouldn't even notice the fact that it pulls. Well anyways, its leaking coolant from the water pump and the radiator.

[blackbombshell95]

Well, the thing it still pulls. I'm not worried about tire wear, I just don't like it pulling.

 

I thought there is no way to adjust the rear end?

 

Front - Rear camber/toe is adjustable in front and rear. Caster is NOT adjustable.

[97loudcut]

You have to also consider you have 245's and they will pull to whichever side the road is leaning to. With my 255's sometimes at intersections I would get sucked to the center lane because the ground was uneven

[Brian P]

how the heck is rear toe adjustable????

[5speedz34]

how the heck is rear toe adjustable????

 

x2.

 

Yeah, Matt I have that problem with this car if the road is uneven it will shoot me in the a certain direction. It's a bitch.

[97loudcut]

how the heck is rear toe adjustable????

 

x2.

 

Yeah, Matt I have that problem with this car if the road is uneven it will shoot me in the a certain direction. It's a bitch.

 

I used to have an intersection back at home (21 mile & Gratiot) where it would pull me so hard into the left turning lane that I would have to turn my wheel almost to 3/4 o'clock to stay out. Really uneven road with pwn wider tires.

 

That's why I think your sisters alignment isnt all that off. Maybe when I come over today we can throw my 205 on her front and see if she still pulls.

[blackbombshell95]

Rear toe is non essentric. You losen the toe nut, and you move the WHEEL either left or right while the toe is loose. When it is in the right spot tighten the toe nut. Non essentric toe

[Brian P]

which nut, is this on the knuckle? Anything that I'd *think* would make toe adjustable in some way, I haven't seen anything like an elongated bolt hole or anything. I also haven't looked for a nut like it either.

 

Interesting though!

[5speedz34]

Yeah, where is the nut?!

[blackbombshell95]

The 2 big nuts in the center of the rear alignment arms that go from one wheel to the other. Anybody have a pic of underneath the car? It is a very simple procedure. Done it many times while doing alignments on Gen I's