Tore into my 3.1 today for intake gasket job got a few questions

[stiv2k]

So I decided I'd be replacing a whole bunch of gaskets in my 3.1 including intake gaskets and valve cover gaskets. When I removed both valve covers, I noticed only the rear valve cover screws had grommets on them. The front ones did not. Is this normal?

 

Also, can anyone explain to me how to remove the pushrods so the gasket can come out?

 

Lastly, are vaccuum lines supposed to be as brittle and weak as mine were when I accidentally snapped 3 of them?

 

Thanks for your opinions i'll try to post some pics of the job later today or tomorrow

[Mach 5]

I believe that they should both have grommets on the valve covers. Maybe they are stuck to the valve covers or stuck to the bolts. You unbolt the rockers from the top nut. As for the vacuum lines, I used landscape tubing that I got at Home Depot.

[stiv2k]

They are supposed to have grommets.

 

You will have to loosen the rocker arms to get the pushrods out. Then readjust them in the correct sequence.

 

Yes. They are brittle. They are, after all, 15 years old.

 

can you elaborate on this? what do you mean readjust in the correct sequence? sorry i've never done this big of a job on my engine before so i'm still new w/ some of this...

 

Also, what do you recommend I do with those vac. lines? It broke right at the connector where the 3 lines plug into the throttle body and I know for sure they don't sell that at advance auto. Should I look for one at a j/y or should I attempt to fix it with tubing from auto parts + shrink wrap?

[Crazy K]

I also recommend outing on new injector O rings on both sides of the injectors, and checking the injectors with a digital Ohmeter.

 

 

[Robby1870]

I also recommend outing on new injector O rings on both sides of the injectors, and checking the injectors with a digital Ohmeter.

 

 

 

Yeah, should be around 12 Ohms. Wit new injector O-rings, they will be tough to get back into their holes in the Lower intake and get the fuel rail back on them.

[stiv2k]

What about the cylinders on the intake/exhaust stroke where the springs are under tension? Do I have to worry about those popping up and hurting me or something?

[stiv2k]

How do I crank the engine one full revolution? Am I gonna have to plug the battery back in and crank it or something?

[stiv2k]

Interesting my 1992 service manual just says to tighten the rockers down to 25 ft lbs it doesn't mention having to do any special adjustment procedure. BTW, where do I have to put black RTV sealant?

 

And the new felpro gasket has 6 round plastic nail-looking things to keep it lined up right over the heads. The nail things sit inside little holes on the heads. My problem is that the nail things broke off and melted themselves in the holes and the new ones will not fit in place now. I'll take pics to clarify my point but is this something I should worry about?

 

Last, as hard as I tried, I couldn't stop gunk from falling into the heads/camshaft. I used paper towels to cover the holes but some stuff still got in. Is this bad? Also a lot of coolant and oil mixed when i pulled off the LIM and it's just sitting in the cam/pushrod area. Will changing the oil after this project is done fix that?

 

[attachment deleted by admin] Removed to free up storage space.

[Robby1870]

You need to try and get those little melted tips things out. A small ice pick, a pocket knife, small flat head screwdriver, any should work. As for the coolant mixing, you need to change the oil out since you got "a lot" a mixing. BTW, I'm pretty sure the rocker arm torque spec is 18ft-lbs. The RTV goes on the block in between the heads. There are two S-shaped spaces about 1/2" wide between the heads where the gasket does not touch. The lower intake meets up with the block here and you need RTV in between there. Make sure you have the lower intake gasket on and everything ready for the Lower Intake to go on before you lay down a strip of RTV.

[per0781]

wow those pics bring back memories

[patgizz]

a shopvac is your best friend for sucking shit out of intake ports, lifter valley, etc...

 

use a pick to get the nubs from the old gasket out

 

 

[stiv2k]

I tried using a small flathead screwdriver, they are stuck in there really good and I couldn't get any of them out. I'll try some more tomorrow. If all I need to do is torque the rockers down, when does this "valve lash adjustment" come into play?

[19Cutlass94]

You dont need to adjust the valve lash. You have a hydraulic roller lifters. Which means they take up the slack. Just tighten down the rockers.

 

The only time you need to adjust valve lash is when you have solid roller lifters. BTW, adjusting valve lash is a PITA! and would basically be near impossible on these cars.

[stiv2k]

straight, thanks for clearing that up!

[patgizz]

You dont need to adjust the valve lash. You have a hydraulic roller lifters. Which means they take up the slack. Just tighten down the rockers.

 

The only time you need to adjust valve lash is when you have solid roller lifters. BTW, adjusting valve lash is a PITA! and would basically be near impossible on these cars.

 

that is very, VERY incorrect. like so wrong i dunno where to start.

 

 

[IRONDOG442]

Looks to me like this poor guy is in way over his head...

[Crazy K]

I've used greased q-tips to pull stuff off out of the intake valve area. works great! I also have... dropped a bolt into one once.... had to fish it out with a magnet on a string!

 

again you should replace the o-rings, and you should lub them with dielectric/tune-up/silicone grease. should allow them to virtually pop in place... and it protects them.

 

for the stuck plastic bits, how about drilling them out at low RPM, but with a small bit so as not to enlarge the holes? ...otherwise light work with a hammer and nail might work!

 

 

[19Cutlass94]

You dont need to adjust the valve lash. You have a hydraulic roller lifters. Which means they take up the slack. Just tighten down the rockers.

 

The only time you need to adjust valve lash is when you have solid roller lifters. BTW, adjusting valve lash is a PITA! and would basically be near impossible on these cars.

 

that is very, VERY incorrect. like so wrong i dunno where to start.

 

 

 

Allright mr know it all, set it straight.......

[19Cutlass94]

Lifters which these engines DO NOT have.

 

Mechanical Lifters

 

All pushrod engines using mechanical (solid) lifters, or mechanical roller lifters, must have an adjustable valve train so that precise adjustment for "Valve Lash" can be made to match the camshaft's requirements. Valve lash is the running clearance that exists between the tip of the valve stem and the valves mating surface of the rocker arm. (It is expressed in the Crane Catalog as "Valve Lash" and on the camshaft specification card as "Valve Setting". Both terms mean the same thing.)

 

The amount of valve lash can vary between camshaft profile designs, being as small as .010" on some and as great as .035" on others. It is important to use the recommended valve lash when you first test the performance of the engine. You must also be concerned with thermal expansion of the engine components. (This is especially true if using aluminum alloy cylinder heads, or block.)

 

For this reason, Crane requires that the valve lash be set with the engine "Hot" on all pushrod engines using mechanical lifters. This will insure that the minimum required clearance (valve lash) is maintained throughout the engine's operating temperature range.

 

Compensating for a Cold Engine when Adjusting Valve Lash

 

When installing a new cam, the engine will be cold but the lash specifications are for a hot engine. What are you to do? There is a correction factor that can be used to get close. We mentioned that the alloy of the engine parts can be affected by thermal expansion in different ways, therefore the amount of correction factor to the lash setting depends on whether the cylinder heads and block are made out of cast iron or aluminum.

 

You can take the "hot" setting given to you in the catalog or cam specification card and alter it by the following amount to get a "cold" lash setting.

 

With iron block and iron heads, add .002"

With iron block and aluminum heads, subtract .006".

With both aluminum block and heads, subtract .012".

Remember this correction adjustment is approximate and is only meant to get you close for the initial start up of the engine. After the engine is warmed up to its proper operating temperature range, you must go back and reset all the valves to the proper "hot" valve lash settings.

 

Setting Valve Lash on Mechanical Cams

 

All the valves must be set individually and only when the lifter is properly located on the base circle of the lobe. At this position the valve is closed and there is no lift taking place. How will you know when the valve you are adjusting is in the proper position with the lifter on the base circle of the cam? This can be accomplished by watching the movement of the valves.

 

1. When the engine is hot (at operating temperature) remove the valve covers and pick the cylinder that you are going to adjust.

 

2. Hand turn the engine in its normal direction of rotation while watching the exhaust valve on that particular cylinder. When the exhaust valve begins to open, stop and adjust that cylinder's intake valve. (Why? Because when the exhaust is just beginning to open, the intake lifter will be on the base circle of the lobe, so the intake is the one we can now adjust.)

 

3. Use a feeler gauge, set to the correct valve lash, and place it between the tip of the valve stem and rocker arm. Adjust until you arrive at the proper setting and lock the adjuster in place.

 

4. After the intake valve has been adjusted, continue to rotate the engine, watching that same intake valve. The intake valve will go to full lift and then begin to close. When the intake is almost closed, stop and adjust the exhaust valve on that particular cylinder. (Again, when we see the intake valve almost closed, we are sure that the exhaust lifter is on the base circle of the lobe.) Use the feeler gauge and follow the procedure described before in step 3.

 

5. Both valves on this cylinder are now adjusted, so move to your next cylinder and follow the same procedure again. In the future you may find shortcuts to this method, but it still remains the best way to do the job correctly.

 

 

 

There is a hydraulic pre-load, but how many people here are atually going to do this??? Im willing to bet about 99% ( allowing for the 1% of people to argue and just go aganist me ) will not do this and will just tighten down the rockers.

 

Fast and Easy Way to Check Hydraulic Lifter Preload when using Non-Adjustable Rocker Arms

 

With the cam, hydraulic lifters and pushrods in place, install your rocker arm assembly. Use the prescribed method in your repair manual and torque down all the valve train bolts in the proper sequence. Pick a cylinder that you are going to check. Hand rotate the engine in its normal direction of rotation until both valves are closed. You are on the compression cycle for that cylinder. (At this position the valve springs are at their least amount of tension making the job a little easier to do.)

 

Wait a few minutes, allowing the lifters to bleed down. Now, lay a rigid straightedge across the cylinder head, supporting it on the surface of the head where the valve cover gasket would go. Using a metal scribe and the straightedge, carefully scribe a line on both pushrods. Now carefully remove the torque from all valve train bolts, removing any pressure from the pushrods. Wait a few minutes for the pushrod seat in the hydraulic lifter to move back to the neutral position. Carefully scribe a new line on both pushrods.

 

Measure the distance between the two scribe marks, it represents the amount of lifter preload. If the lines are .020" to .060" apart you have proper lifter preload. If the lines are the same or less than .020" apart you have no, or insufficient, preload. If the lines are further apart than .060", you have excessive lifter preload. To bring your preload into tolerance, use one of the methods described in the next section if necessary, or call the Crane Tech Line for assistance (904/258-6174).

 

Methods to Adjust for Proper Hydraulic Lifter Preload

 

There are several different methods for increasing or decreasing the amount of lifter preload, depending on valve train design and how the rocker arm is held onto the cylinder head. Keep in mind that the automotive manufacturers have made changes to the valve train over the years. What may work on one year's engine may not work for another, even though they are basically the same engine. There is one method that universally works on all these engines, change the pushrod length!

 

Use a longer pushrod to increase preload, a shorter to reduce preload. Crane offers various length pushrods, and offers custom length pushrods. Many methods are illustrated throughout the catalog, here are a few of them: Custom length pushrods Bottleneck stud shims Bridge mount rocker arm shims Pedestal mount rocker arm shims Adjustable pushrods Conversion rocker arm studs "Kool Nut" adjusting nuts Guideplate and rocker arm conversion kits Adjustable rocker arms (both stud and shaft mounted) Replacement guideplates and studs

[patgizz]

i'm not even going to get into this in depth with you.

 

at any rate - if he has non adjustable rocker arms, he's good to go - you torque them down and go.

 

straight out of your little quotes:

 

Fast and Easy Way to Check Hydraulic Lifter Preload when using Non-Adjustable Rocker Arms

 

however, i'm not sure you know this, but most vehicles have ADJUSTABLE rockers. so you don't just crank them down and go, or the first time you hit the key you bend valves and dent pistons. whether it be solid lifters or hydraulic, flat tappet or roller. there is proper procedure to adjust the lash(where with solid lifters you need a tiny bit of clearance, with hydraulics you need a little preload).

 

but whatever. go build yourself a small block and crank the rockers down on assembly in whatever position theyre in and have a ball

[19Cutlass94]

I wasnt talking about most vehicles, I was talking about his.

[patgizz]

your comments were clear to state that anything with hydraulic roller lifters needs no rocker/lash adjustment. stop backpeddling

 

You dont need to adjust the valve lash. You have a hydraulic roller lifters. Which means they take up the slack.

[19Cutlass94]

Theres no valve lash adjustment. I said nothing about rocker adjustment because he doesnt need to worry about it.

[THe_DeTAiL3R]

keep it on topic (about his engine) not to confuse to poor guy.

 

BTW, I'm pretty sure the rocker arm torque spec is 18ft-lbs

 

I think that's what it was on my 3100 when I did the LIM...