update: page 2, heater core and circuit

[Crazy K]

:bawl: :bawl: One's leaking the other got clogged. I tried disconnecting it and giving it CPR. I blew into the outlet pipe, but but it had only marginal effect.

 

I've pulled a used one from a low mileage car, and I guess I'm going to learn how to change them on the run. It really doesn't look that hard... if you're elastic man. lol

 

EDIT updated cause of problem, page 2

[Bossman429]

:? There's only one heater core, are you refering to the 2 pipes coming out the firewall?

I'd go with a new heater core to go through the trouble, they're only like $40-50 I think.

[Crazy K]

No, sorry for the lack of clarity... both my cars at the same time. I already pulled my winter car's core, it is restricted. I blew through the old and j/y low mileage one. big difference. I bought the j/y one for my 95 CS(I'd used either alumaseal or gunk to nearly stop the leak... and thus it's kinda restricted...) but now it's gonna go into my 92 lumina

[patgizz]

worst part is getting the hoses onto/off of the core behind the mpfi's ginormous plenum, even with the motor rotated forward.

 

i've done a few, just make sure to replace the foam seal from the factory one to the new one or else the air will blow around the core instead of through it, and you'll be cold all winter.

[Crazy K]

I had to cut the luminas set of hoses and gonna have to replace them tomorrow. oh well

but now that the heater core is out I have been running hot water "backwards" through it. The restrictions have lessened, Maybe it will be ok to reuse? or should someone shoot me?

[DiscoStudd]

So is the heat output weak on the car with the "clogged" heater core? (Not in the airflow velocity sense, but the temperature sense.) I've got a buddy with a Ciera that has weak heat output (blower works great) and we just changed the T-Stat to no avail. I told him that either the damper that closes off the airflow around the evaporator core is stuck or the heater core is scaled over.

 

Hearing of someone else with the same problem kinda validates my suspicion that it's the heater core.

 

If you end up reusing the clogged core that you flushed out, post back on how it worked out. If it works for you, then I suppose it might not hurt for my buddy to pick up a bottle of Prestone cooling system flush and run it through his heater core...

[biff85ta]

How much is a new one? This seems like a lot of effort over a part that most of the time is fairly cheap.

[GutlessSupreme]

:? There's only one heater core, are you refering to the 2 pipes coming out the firewall?

I'd go with a new heater core to go through the trouble, they're only like $40-50 I think.

[Crazy K]

ok, again I have two cars that both have had heater core failures. and 40 to 50 may be cheap, but thats still a days pay when I'm limited on resources. If I need another one, I'll go pull one from a j/y from a low mileage car...

 

DiscoStudd, the's what my problem was, I replaced the thermo, which made it slightly warmer... but it was restricted... as for flushing, the standard flush might work, but... I think you should do this to the ciera, or anyother car before you try replacing..... Disconnect both the input and output from the Heater core(easiest at the engine side or the hoses) and force flow water from a hose through the heater core backwards as the small inlets are most likely clogged at the input of course... or both ways, etc...

 

I used a new oil pan and drained my coolant, which I will reuse, since it is new. But for anyone else, it would be a good time for a flush.

[DiscoStudd]

Disconnect both the input and output from the Heater core(easiest at the engine side or the hoses) and force flow water from a hose through the heater core backwards as the small inlets are most likely clogged at the input of course... or both ways, etc...

Exactly what I had in mind . I'm considering picking up one of those pumps that you attach to your cordless drill and 2 lengths of garden hose and rigging that up to the heater hoses. Backflush it with clean water first, then the Prestone "flush" shit mixed in with a little water. Rinse, lather, repeat.

 

It's kind of a shame to go through all of that shit in order to replace a heater core when it's not leaking externally ...

[DiscoStudd]

Here's the pump that I'm contemplating buying to aid in the flushing of the heater core:

 

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=6970&productId=11948&R=11948

 

If it were warmer, I'd just use the ole garden hose . The pump will at least keep my garage floor from turning into a "Coolant Swamp" ...

[Crazy K]

nice idea, but... if you're talking about making it a circulating system, you might just be moving the clog around!

 

better idea... you can get HELP brand heatercore line plugs... I would disconnect the heater core, plug the lines then move the car outside, force water from a garden hose through the system, backwards... forwards... etc... then drive the car inside again and hook everything back up. The place in lines I would disconnect at is where the lines attach at the engine, not the PITA firewall connection.

 

OR... hook a garden hose up, and run another hose from an outlet and out the garage door. And a bit of help from a friend wouldn't hurt.

[Crazy K]

edited out... sorry bout that!

[93CutlassSupreme]

holy double post!

[Crazy K]

It wasn't the heater core! all that work and nada. It appears that the feed line is blocked, probably at that damn thing everyone hates, but whose name i don't know. at least the core isn't restricted now.

[DiscoStudd]

Using a garden hose isn't an option for me, as I shut off the supply to my house's outside spigots over a month ago. Minnesota. Middle of December. 'Nuff said.

 

I have no intention of making my little pump setup do a "loop." I'll have the "supply" end of the pump immersed in a 5-gal pail full of clean water, and the other end in another 5-gal pail to catch the crap.

 

Even if it were warm out, I'd have to think twice about flushing coolant down my driveway, 'cause my dog would probably lap it up...

[Crazy K]

ok, the heater core was restricted, but not too badly. By blowing into the hoses (while still installed) you could tell. But it was the "pot" metal connector that was clogged. I bought a new one from autozone for 12.99, and installed it (it is magnetic and appears to be stainless steel btw) however, the quick disconnect fitting is notably weak on these, and the original one (2 years old) was broken. I will attempt to check a few different stores and see if anyone has a better quality disconnect fitting sold seperately or a whole better designed connector/fitting.

 

In order to put it in properly it is necesary to remove the crossover for clearance. but I also broke the temperature sensor for the ecm located above it (this is a 3.1 motor) it ws the original sensor from the factory with AC stamped on it. it was working fine even with 205,000 miles. It is together and all works well now.

I also have for the first time in 205000 miles a new hose, rather two, that connect the heatercore to the rest of the cars circuit. I used liquid teflon to seal the threads.

now to start on the other car.

[Crazy K]

final update: Having driven the trip to work and back, the heater is working fantastic. Better than any car I've ever driven. Now I want to do this to my other 2 cars! Cold weather fucking sucks!

Now if I could only retrofit in a 12v powered hot cocoa maker.

[Crazy K]

ok now car 2, 95 CS sedan, leaking heater core. Some heat but plenty of antifreeze smell. I had used alumaseal and it effectively slowed the leak, it only used 1/2 gallon of coolant in the last year, but that was only 4000 miles.

don't let the picture above fool you. The clean metal is too shiney it overexposes and whited out the other pics I took. the metal you see is just rust.

 

all the dark area on the core itself is scaly rust.

So I've got a 2nd project on my hands, put the lumina old core has been flushed, so.... Wish me luck!

[1990lumina]

good luck!

[Crazy K]

good luck!

Geez, I wasn't really expecting such a reply!. You got me cracking up! thanks!

 

Keep in mind my butt freezes as I am lying sprawled in the snow while struggling to fr access to the heater core. and then my shirts and jacket spill up and snow gets in my crack........... Boy O Boy, I'm gonna have fun!

[DiscoStudd]

good luck!

What a post whore!

 

How long did it take you to dismantle the dash on the 95 Cutty? Or what I should be asking is what all did you have to remove inside the car to get the heater core exposed?

 

I'm looking forward to the day that I have to replace the heater core in my Regal (shyeah riiiiight) and your dismantling of your Cutty dash has piqued my curiosity as to what I'm up against when that time comes...

[Crazy K]

remove center console if equipped. you'll have to remove the the shift handle, but I find the shifter is extremely constricting... (but mine has no actual shifter, just a shifteless center console)

Remove dash kick pads, the harness on the CS runs along the bottom of the dash, you have to pry loose the harness clips(door panel types) for clearance to the drip pan.

You also have to remove the accelorator pedal with it's bracket (two 10mm bolts)

 

You need to pull back the carpet and pull two bolts that hold a piece of ductwork between the heater core assembly as the under rug ducts. then pop this duct piece out.

Next There is a smaller plastic 'duct' pan held on by three bolts (either 7mm or 5/16) remove this.

BTW, On the firewall there in the hvac outlet rubber hose, you must remove this. It just slips on and of, and is on a plastic tube, so NO Vicegrips!

Then a remove the larger pan with maybe 6 more bolts, You need to be very careful to pry down on the pan to remove. I broke mine :x Once this pan is off, you should see the heater core.

 

Also, the heater core can be disconnected from it's metal lines, buy popping each of the metal clips (four catches per clip) holding it on the line, and carefully wiggling it loose.

BTW did I mention to drain the coolant system? And I disconnect the heater line hose at a spot where i can blow into it to remove as much coolant as i can as well.

I have not finished reassembly, but the pipes where they connect to the heater core have O-rings, I would lube them with silicone grease, availible at NAPA or Carquest.

 

hopefully enough?

[DiscoStudd]

I was more or less wondering if you had to remove the whole dash or if you could get to it from underneath. I've had the "under-dash" and the rest of that shit apart enough times when installing my stereo wiring and such, so I follow where you're going. Still sounds fun, though!

[Crazy K]

Especially when you're lying upside down with your butt on the icy ground outside the car! IT's not bad compared to most other cars, at least, but it is some work!