I Think We Hit the Spark Plug Jackpot!

[Grand Moff Joseph]

All,

 

A little over a month ago, I posted a thread here asking for advice on some weird powertrain issues I was having with my Lumina. I mentioned that I had AutoLite single tip platinum spark plugs in my car, which prompted a four page discussion/debate over the merits of platinum plugs, and the science behind the "waste-spark" systems in our cars.

 

Anyway, I did a ton of research into this, and consulted with my wife, who is a materials engineer, and I concluded that the answer to my spark plug woes was double tip platinum plugs. So, I bought a set of AutoLite Double Platinum plugs, and I just had them installed yesterday. Folks, I think I've hit the spark plug jackpot!!

 

My car was waiting for me when I got to the shop, and as soon as I fired it up, I had to stop and listen for a second - why? Because I heard NO vibration or extra noise coming from the engine!! I put the gear, and still no noise! I was in utter shock at this point, but the best test was yet to come, on the road.

 

I pulled out of the parking lot from a dead stop, and the throttle response was smoother than glass! No sign of hesitation or jerkiness. I cruised at low street speeds, and punched the gas a fewtimes, and the car responded perfectly. Still, no extra vibration or engine noise, even at a full stop with the A/C on! :shock:

 

All that being said, in summary, I replaced my plugs with double platinums, and even with the FFP dogbones on the car, my 3.1 responds better than it was probably ever designed to do, and the difference is unbelieveable!

[digitaloutsider]

 

I give the plugs about 2,000 miles. Should've just saved your money and bought plain-old AC Delco's.

[Grand Moff Joseph]

Wow, that is one funny picture...LMAO

 

As for the plugs, most people here have said that they replace their AC Delcos every 12-18 months anyway, so even if these double platinums wear out after 2K miles, it will about even out anyway.

 

Besides, the price difference was marginal, and if nothing else, it was worth a shot...I'll just keep an eye on it and see how it goes.

[GP1138]

[Grand Moff Joseph]

 

Yes, yes, I know. You're thinking I'm the ultimate dumbass for this one. Well, here's my reasoning behind this.

 

1. A number of people here said that our cars were never designed for platinum plugs. However, every GM dealer I called/spoke with said that if they replaced my plugs with AC Delcos, they would put AC Delco Platinums in, as that is standard procedure for any car as old as mine. When asked for further detail, they said that the regular AC Delcos wear out too fast, and that platinums provide better spark for my older engine

 

2. Whoever made the speech on here about platinum plugs melting at a lower temperature than the copper plugs was wrong. Platinum melts at a far higher temperature than copper. (consult webelements.com for more info)

 

3. The whole issue last time centered on the fact that with single tip plugs, the back three plugs get ass-raped because the spark is going backwards through the plug. Thus, the patinum wears down faster, thus degrading the plug at a vastly accelerated rate. That being said, double platinum plugs were built specifically to address this problem, as many cars have a waste spark system to begin with. So, you get all the benefits of platinum plugs, with added protection from the backasswards firing of our cars.

 

4. Again, if GM sells them, and recommends them for my car, why would they be bad in the first place? (see #1)

 

/not a flame to anyone, just explaining myself

[cutlsp]

You trust everything a gm dealership tells you... I feel sorry for that car :?

[IBuiltMine-o1oo]

um Platinum plugs are standard equipment on my 97 cutlass......so they have to work.....im going with factor replacements instead of my bosh+2s

they they went with iridium in 2002 to one up the platinums! but those are like 8.50 each at the dealership!

[Grand Moff Joseph]

You trust everything a gm dealership tells you... I feel sorry for that car :?

 

No, I most certainly do NOT trust what everything a GM dealer tells me. That is why I take my car to an independent mechanic for any work that I cannot do myself.

 

I only consulted with GM dealerships in this case because of the very confliciting opinions I was seeing on this forum regarding spark plug types, benefits, drawbacks, etc. Based on the arguments/opinions expressed here, as well as the sometimes erroneous explanations given, I could not make a sound judgement by myself as to what I should do.

 

So, I contacted a number of area dealerships, and they all stated that platinum plugs work fine in our cars, and they have received no reports of problems from customers who have had them installed. To verify this information, I also contacted a number of independent mechanics, none of whom could report any problems or issues that they have had with putting platinum plugs into most any car. In fact, a numberof them suggested using double platinums to compensate for the backasswards firing our our engines.

 

The bottom line is this: If these plugs go to hell in less than a year/a few thousand miles, then I will be the first to admit that the double platinums didn't work as well as intended, and I'll happily move to regular plugs. But, until that time, I have plenty of faith in these plugs, and the opinions of the independent mechanics I spoke with.

[GP1138]

Ok, here's the deal. I learned through GM TRAINING that Platinums are a no-no in any waste-spark ignition system. That being said, I don't know that they knew about these double platinum plugs, so I'm keeping my mouth shut on the issue from now on.

[Grand Moff Joseph]

Ok, here's the deal. I learned through GM TRAINING that Platinums are a no-no in any waste-spark ignition system. That being said, I don't know that they knew about these double platinum plugs, so I'm keeping my mouth shut on the issue from now on.

 

That's fine, and I respect your opinion. I was not trying to flame you or to take anything out on you at all. I've been flamed by a number of people over the years (both on and off this board) for my choice of spark plugs, and in this case I felt the need to explain/defend my reasoning.

 

Again, I did not intend to upset you (or anyone else) with my comments, but if I did, I apologize.

 

-GMJ

[Dirty Rockstar]

I ran Platinum 4s in my Lumina for almost 5k miles.. And it was zippy and running awesome right up to the accident..

 

As if that's not enough, I ran Platinmum 4s in my 87 6k for almost 7k.. Gave the old 2.5 a nice breath of fresh air, and made me hate it a little less.. I never understood everyone's problems with the Platinums.. I have never had a problem with them..

 

I dont want to start anything.. I was just stating my experience..

[White93z34]

My car was waiting for me when I got to the shop, and as soon as I fired it up, I had to stop and listen for a second - why? Because I heard NO vibration or extra noise coming from the engine!! I put the gear, and still no noise! I was in utter shock at this point, but the best test was yet to come, on the road.

 

I pulled out of the parking lot from a dead stop, and the throttle response was smoother than glass! No sign of hesitation or jerkiness. I cruised at low street speeds, and punched the gas a fewtimes, and the car responded perfectly. Still, no extra vibration or engine noise, even at a full stop with the A/C on!

 

not to be a dick, but thats how my cars always felt, and i run plain old ACDs. however, run it for awhile and see how they feel, if they get trashed in short term try delcos and see, you can be a test mule

[3pt1lumina]

if the car runs fine and is peppy then who cares what's in it? if they last for 80k then great if they last 2k then you live and learn.

 

I have acdelco rapidfires in my car. I don't know what it had before but it ran like absolute garbage. I've always been satisfied and will continue with those. But if there is another option, explore it and see what happens. Never know unless you try.

[supreme_style21]

Good ol' Delcos don't last? I took the original Delcos out of my '94 GP at 90k. And, from what I can tell from the service records on my '95 GP, the plugs are still original with 108,000 on them.. they're due for replacement, but they are by no means a short-lived plug!

[THe_DeTAiL3R]

Good ol' Delcos don't last? I took the original Delcos out of my '94 GP at 90k. And, from what I can tell from the service records on my '95 GP, the plugs are still original with 108,000 on them.. they're due for replacement, but they are by no means a short-lived plug!

 

 

I replaced my plugs this past week with plain AC Delcos. This is the first time in at least 16000km (since I owned the car). The ones I pulled out were the same- plain AC Delcos. They looked really good too, hell I could have just cleaned them up and put them back in!

[ShockTherapy]

he said double platinums,,, platinum on both ends... not just the electrode, meaning when the waste spark goes off it's not killing the plug, i think.

 

if that made no snese, double platinums are made for waste spark...

 

furthermore, it's his car, so what do you people care?

[digitaloutsider]

Um. Why the fuck would you want it plantinum on both ends? What would you get out of that? It's killing the plug no matter how you look at it, and the only reason I even said anything is because he was told repeatedly that 60/6's constantly have problems with platinum plugs. It's his money. I don't care.

[maybe2fast]

I just through in some AC Delco Rapid Fires and the car runs really nice.

[solid_raiden223]

Anyone know thst The Spark in any + number is gonna go to the same one every fucking time... Electricty moves to the closest ground... no matter what.. so platnum + whatever is absolute CRAP

[Canada]

You trust everything a gm dealership tells you... I feel sorry for that car :?

 

No, I most certainly do NOT trust what everything a GM dealer tells me. That is why I take my car to an independent mechanic for any work that I cannot do myself.

 

Because an independent shop is MUCH better. Ha.

 

Service advisors may not always give the correct information......this is for TWO reasons. The shop is slow, and they are trying to sell maintaince.....or your car is so fucking old, that they simply don't know anymore. Anyone here know what oil filter should go on a 1983 Cadillac Coupe Deville 350 Diesel? (Its a PF61....also used on the Northstar line and the I series engines.) I've seen a service advisor asked that question....and in NO way is it different that you guys asking them what should be used for a spark plug in a 3.1L MPFI.

 

If it involves parts, you should ask the proper person.........PARTS. I believe the proper spark plug is an AC Delco RapidFire.....I could be wrong, as I work in the shop, not in parts.

 

Platinum's not liking waste spark? My 3100 and 3400 are both waste spark engines.....and came with Platniums out of the box. In fact, I have never seen a poor drivability concern due to AC Delco plugs.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong.....but don't Delco Platnium plugs have a platnium center electrode and a platnium pad on the tip?

 

Your engine may run very well on these Auto Lite plugs.....I'm sure its not that bad of plug. However, its no magic bullet.

[digitaloutsider]

The only time I've ever had any sort of platinum-plug related issue has been in the Gen-II 60/6's. My 3.1 ate through a set of Bosch in under 4k miles, and then a set of platinum RapidFires in about 8k. The 3400 in the Montana came stock with them, and is still at 80k miles on the original plugs (yes I know, blow me. money, time, and HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO GET TO THOSE REAR PLUGS?! constraint).

[gp90se]

Lets start with bosch plugs, they will wear out in a waste ignition system, be it GM, Dodge or shitsubishi.

 

Plat plugs run fine in GM DIS as long as they are a good solid plug, but I personally dont run them. My regal is running good ol delcos, my GP will be running the older style rapidfires and my blazer runs champions. The "melting plat tip" is only an issue when forced induction comes into play.

 

Autolite plugs don't seem to last as long as long as delcos in DIS systems, not sure why though.

 

so, recap from my post:

 

Bosch = bad

Plats = fine for all our motors (minus turbos)

best plugs IMO = Delcos/NGKs

[gp90se]

unfortunately, right now the market isnt that demanding for the TGP's. Ive seen good running TGPs go for $500, and motors with low miles go for the same price.

 

I think if you hold out and find the right person, $1000 isn't out of the question, but like I said, no huge market right now.

[Brian P]

Did you take your old plugs back? I'm willing to bet at least one has a crack in the porcelain. There are times I bought plugs and they were cracked while still in the box.

 

and HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO GET TO THOSE REAR PLUGS?! constraint).

 

I've done them in two minivans. First I did them while changing the lower intake gaskets, so I got to them from the top. Second time I raised the van and got to them from underneath.

[Canada]

Plugs aren't bad......its getting the new wires on in the right order thats tricky.

 

To you guys who say their engines EAT spark plugs......what exactly do you mean by this? Please describe the condition of the plug.....color, gap, carbon tracking, etc. Also.....when you put the new plugs in, did you replace the wires as well?

 

The reason I ask.....if you replace only the plugs, and they were carbon tracked.....the wires were too. Bad wires will make bad plugs in a fairly low amount of time.