Poll added--Handling dilemma. Leaf vs CO.

[lakefxgp96]

So i know i want to go road-coursing my GP within the next couple of years to show off in front of some cobras and 911s---and do it regularly, But drag racing is a lot of fun too and i give weight a lot of attention when doing mods...

 

What would you recommend for a setup? Currently all I have done suspension/steering wise are new strut mounts, KYB struts, Ball joints, 1 front wheel hub (will do next later) 17" wheels (getting DR someday, 17s great for handling.) outter tie rods. AWeb's rear STB.

 

I've heard that birchmount makes rear leaf springs but they are considerably heavier than stock and some say they are noisy. Any thoughts on this?

 

So heres the options i think i should go with, keeping in mind weight vs optimum handling, and of course safety

 

1 option:

 

front:

ST lowering springs

STB

poly swaybar bushings

 

 

rear:

Flex-a-form leaf spring, (because it is lighter)

rear STB

MOOGs

GMPP trailing arms

 

2nd option for rear:

 

FFP coilovers

Rear STB

addco swaybar

GMPPs

 

 

Given the 2 options, which would you recommend for light weight AND for the best handling for autocross/road course?

 

Thanks for your suggestions.

[Guest TurboSedan]

from what i have seen neither the FAF spring nor the Birchmount spring will lower the car hardly at all. the Birchmount spring also seems to be heavier and more noise.

 

as much as i hate my coilovers....they are the way to go IMO. the only time i ever have problems with them is when i go up an incline while turning sharply.

[dohc v6]

Go with the birchmount sprig. it rides good and it has an awsome drop. becuase people went with the 2 in drop it just was not enough because of the weight up front it did not look level. so i ordered a 3in drop and it is awsome. the c/o are junk imo. when you go over a bump and turn,since the c,o dont have a auxiliary spring or a spring hat the spring tends to come out of the mount because the spring is not compressed all the time. secont the thickness of the metal on the strut tower is not all that thick. it might not do any damage right away but i promise you it will over time. so go with the birchmount imo the best option

[92 GP]

from what i have seen neither the FAF spring nor the Birchmount spring will lower the car hardly at all. the Birchmount spring also seems to be heavier and more noise.

 

as much as i hate my coilovers....they are the way to go IMO. the only time i ever have problems with them is when i go up an incline while turning sharply.

 

you should pay attention more

 

The birchmount drops it 2.25" to match the intrax.

 

BUT, it's got a long break-in period. That's cuz it's four leafs put together, and it needs time to settle it in.

[dohc v6]

the 3in drop is only 3 pieces of metal. but if you put everything back to stock the front would be lower than the back. thats why you want to get a lower drop in the back

[lakefxgp96]

Do the intrax come with the birchmount spring? is that how i should understand it? or do we still have to get the entire intrax setup separately?

 

So would the 3" drop probably weight less than the 2.25" drop in theory? As far as drag racing is concerned, having slightly more lift in the rear actually comes as an advantage to FWD cars.

[Guest TurboSedan]

you should pay attention more

 

The birchmount drops it 2.25" to match the intrax.

 

BUT, it's got a long break-in period. That's cuz it's four leafs put together, and it needs time to settle it in.

 

pay attention more? to what? like i said, from what i have seen; which includes your car. not low enough IMO, the car is slightly raked which i don't like at all (no offense).

 

when you go over a bump and turn,since the c,o dont have a auxiliary spring or a spring hat the spring tends to come out of the mount because the spring is not compressed all the time. secont the thickness of the metal on the strut tower is not all that thick. it might not do any damage right away but i promise you it will over time. so go with the birchmount imo the best option

 

i disagree for the most part. my coilovers never become unseated when i go over bumps....the only time that ever happens is if i am going up an incline while turning very sharply, such as when entering a steep driveway. i also think the strut tower is definately strong enough, as i have had the coilovers on my car for 4 years/80,000+ hard miles with absolutely no issues.

 

honestly i would like to go with the Birchmount spring with 3" drop but after getting feedback from other membes about it i don't think i will. the 3" drop may get the car low enough for my taste but people are still complaining of harsh ride and spring noise.

[Guest TurboSedan]

Do the intrax come with the birchmount spring? is that how i should understand it? or do we still have to get the entire intrax setup separately?

 

you have to buy them separately. the only way to do that would be to buy a complete '95+ Intrax Monte Carlo spring kit (which leaves you with 2 rear springs you can't use of course), or organize another group buy from Intrax for only the front springs, or find someone on the forum willing to sell theirs.

 

i'm actually using Eibach 1.5" drop front springs right now but my Intrax 1.8" drop springs will be going in soon.

[futuretgper]

becuase people went with the 2 in drop it just was not enough because of the weight up front it did not look level. so i ordered a 3in drop and it is awsome.

 

you have any pics of your car with the 3in drop??

 

i want to sell mine or do an exchange with birchmount for a 3in drop....but im kinda worried about going to the "3in" drop and having it get the saggy ass look in the end!!

[lakefxgp96]

I would think a 'harsh ride' could be augmented by the right strut combination. Maybe some weak gabiels would improve ride 'quality' but at the same time a harsh ride on typical pavement feels great on a super buttery smooth road course track. I should probably add that the GP will lose its 'daily' status as soon as my lumina is in top notch shape and will probably get a 97+ GP as a 3rd car next year some time

 

Right now I'm thinking the birchmount is the way to go, but im a little scared about how much heavier its going to be. If its lets say 20 lbs heavier than stock, that may not seem like a lot but its also on the wrong side of the car for good weight distribution. If its less than 10 lbs more, i would be very happy with that, anyone with a birchmount have an estimate?

 

I would think i would probably get the 2.25 (also known as < 1" :? ) drop anyway just because id rather have a forward stance than a backward one, and over time the spring will weaken to the point where the car is level, which is good too IMO

[dohc v6]

i will post some pics

[futuretgper]

Right now I'm thinking the birchmount is the way to go, but im a little scared about how much heavier its going to be. If its lets say 20 lbs heavier than stock, that may not seem like a lot but its also on the wrong side of the car for good weight distribution.

 

im pretty sure our cars are forward biased in weight distribution....being fwd and not really a "sports car" im almost posative rearward weight would only help "balance" the car (closer to 50-50)!!

 

and i think i read somewhere that they weigh around 25lbs compared to 8lbs for the stock leaf!

 

dohc where u gonna post ur pics!!

[GnatGoSplat]

It's a shame the FAF spring doesn't have enough drop. It really would have been a good option if it had enough drop, because the ride isn't too bad and the spring is lightweight and fiberglass. Possibly even lighter than factory since it's narrower (didn't think to weigh it when I got it).

[92 GP]

you should pay attention more

 

The birchmount drops it 2.25" to match the intrax.

 

BUT, it's got a long break-in period. That's cuz it's four leafs put together, and it needs time to settle it in.

 

pay attention more? to what? like i said, from what i have seen; which includes your car. not low enough IMO, the car is slightly raked which i don't like at all (no offense).

 

You still aren't reading everything

 

After some miles are put on the car, it lowers more. This is because that leafspring has FOUR leafs, that's what causes it to be so stiff. And when you have FOUR of them put together SO tightly, it takes some break-in time. Talk to Davis, his has dropped a lot more since putting his on and driving around!

[dohc v6]

probably 60degreev6. sorry its very easy site to post pics for me. will post link

[Guest TurboSedan]

You still aren't reading everything

 

After some miles are put on the car, it lowers more. This is because that leafspring has FOUR leafs, that's what causes it to be so stiff. And when you have FOUR of them put together SO tightly, it takes some break-in time. Talk to Davis, his has dropped a lot more since putting his on and driving around!

 

i've read everything just because i don't like what i've seen/heard about the Birchmount spring doesn't mean i refuse to read about it or pay attention to your posts.

 

i will have to see it. time will tell.

[intern8tion9l]

i'm back and forth on what to do as well. all i have is opinions that i read, and they seem 50/50. i think if the ffp coilovers weren't so damn much money, it would make the decision easier

[19Cutlass94]

yeah I agree, the money to shove out for the FFP coilovers is a hit but I guess everyone that has em are happy. I duno what I want to do to lower my car right now, that wont happen for a while but it seems like most guys either have the FFP coilovers or the Birchmount spring, although I guess the 3" is better for the spring than the 2.25", so Ive heard.

[lakefxgp96]

is everyone in agreement that leaf springs are fully interchangeable? for instance if i replace the leaf spring on my 96 GP with a birchmount, can i take my stock leaf and put it on the saggy 93 lumina?

 

Thanks for your suggestions everyone, i think at this point im looking at birchmount springs, but is there anything terribly wrong with the flex-a-form springs over the birchmounts? it seems like the complaints are the same for both (didnt lower enough/needs break in, noisy) it would seem if the problems with them are similar and manageable, then wouldnt the lighter spring seem to be the obvious choice?

[blackbombshell95]

FFP coilovers are a must for handling. much better than the rear leaf. Buy EIBACH lowering springs. And just chuck the rear springs away.

[GnatGoSplat]

Thanks for your suggestions everyone, i think at this point im looking at birchmount springs, but is there anything terribly wrong with the flex-a-form springs over the birchmounts? it seems like the complaints are the same for both (didnt lower enough/needs break in, noisy) it would seem if the problems with them are similar and manageable, then wouldnt the lighter spring seem to be the obvious choice?

 

A thousand miles later, and my FAF spring doesn't seem to have broken in hardly at all. Other than that, it's not really noisy and the ride isn't bad. Had it lowered enough, I would be happy. I wanted George to make things right, but he's one of those guys that if you're asking where to send money, he'll reply to email ASAP. If you're complaining about something, you won't hear a peep out of him.

 

My FAF spring really doesn't even seem to be any lower than the stock spring on my 94 convertible.

[AWeb80]

Corey is right, the FFP's are great for handling...

[19Cutlass94]

How can those FAF and birchmount springs be so noisy? But Ive also heard the FFP can be noisy too???

[GnatGoSplat]

FAF isn't any noisier than stock, it's fiberglass.

Yeah, FFP's are noisy, just ask Jay!

[19Cutlass94]

FAF isn't any noisier than stock, it's fiberglass.

Yeah, FFP's are noisy, just ask Jay!

 

yeah I remember him saying that he put dynamat down or something ofthe sort and it didnt cure the noise from the coilovers. But my rear monoleaf has no noise what so ever but then again isnt 4 steel leafs bonded together but I would imagine with a rear STB bar the Birchmount would handle just as good as FFP coilovers. but like Invasion1 said, youd just have to put some shims in to quite that metal on metal noise