Joe590me Posted July 12, 2005 Report Share Posted July 12, 2005 I have read a few threads about a shift kit that will work with my 96 0lds CS, where would I find this shift kit, I never have the time to go looking through all of the threads, thanx alot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THe_DeTAiL3R Posted July 13, 2005 Report Share Posted July 13, 2005 I think B&M makes them what exactly do you want it for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMo60 Posted July 13, 2005 Report Share Posted July 13, 2005 the B&M shift improver is a waste of money, i have one, and it was the biggest waste of $50 ever. it does however help with consistancy in some vehicles. my grand prix would noticeably shift slower as you got more runs at the track in without rest. the shift improver keeps the shifts more the same, you can make the same thing yourself with some vaccume line and a valve. real simple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted July 13, 2005 Report Share Posted July 13, 2005 I always recomend type F trans fluid, it'll make the shifts tighter, help the trans run cooler, and it's better on the transmission then the Trick Shift trans fluid (which has almost no anti-foaming agents - so it'll blow out the lip seals in the trans) --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcrow Posted July 13, 2005 Report Share Posted July 13, 2005 Type F? Isn't that bad? How long have you been doing it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted July 14, 2005 Report Share Posted July 14, 2005 I've been usin' type F pretty much in EVERY w-body I've owned. I've posted the trans fluid facts a few times, and if you want to read them, the facts are located here: http://60degreev6.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=50&page=1 the basic idea of the article is stating that you can use type F in a dex-III trans with no problems, and no life loss from the trans, but you can NOT use Dex-III in a type F trans. Type F is not bad for the trans, if someone tells you otherwise, read the article, then ask them why it's bad - then when they answer incorrectly you can put them in their place. --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Posted July 14, 2005 Report Share Posted July 14, 2005 I know why you aren't supposed to use it.......because a Dextron III transmission is NOT designed for Type F. This is exactly like a Dex-Cool verses Green debate........use what the transmission is supposed to have in it. Type F can still kill your transmission just as easyily as putting Dextron III in a Type F. Those firmer shifts that you get (from the lack of friction modifiers) add a lot of force into the powertrain....it would be very easy to sheer reaction shell teeth or similar parts (like on a 4L60-E) from the increased force. If you want your transmission to shift harder.....buy a proper rebuild type shift kit. One than includes harder parts, new bands, clutchs, and parts for the valve body and accumlators. If you are going to take the time to do something, do it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heza Posted July 14, 2005 Report Share Posted July 14, 2005 as for the B&M crap....if you want it, seal off the vacuum line to the vacuum modulator on the transmission and cap the vacuum modulator off. there...B&M shift enhancer for $0.10...if that. ive always been skeptical about type F in 4t60es. for the same reasons Canada mentioned. 4t60e is a semi-weak transmission as is and jolty shifts just dont really seem healthy for it. ideally, someone should start with a pair of fresh trannies and run DEXTRON III in one, and Type F in the other and see which one takes a crap first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THe_DeTAiL3R Posted July 14, 2005 Report Share Posted July 14, 2005 My tranny with Dex III can chirp the tires going into second (it shouldn't be able to do that, but it does). If that's not a firm shift I dunno what is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutty Posted July 15, 2005 Report Share Posted July 15, 2005 My tranny with Dex III can chirp the tires going into second (it shouldn't be able to do that, but it does). If that's not a firm shift I dunno what is! damn i wish mine could chirp the tires at all. i have tried with no luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THe_DeTAiL3R Posted July 15, 2005 Report Share Posted July 15, 2005 My tranny shifts ABNORMALLY HARD :!: I don't want it to chirp the tires when I WOT.. it's not suppose to do that! LOL. I'm having the tranny looked at on Sat. Hopefully it is repairable and woun't cost too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted July 15, 2005 Report Share Posted July 15, 2005 Canada ... let me ask you this, since you seem to *think* you know what you're talking about (making it blatently obvious that you don't) what exactly does a shift kit do... well, let's take a closer look at this ... shal we? A shift kit is designed to do several things, including, but not limited to, firmer shifts, changed shift points, and enhanced torque load available by increasing pressures against the energizing pistons and seals of the clutch packs ... what will type F fluid do.. humm - let's see, firmer shifts, and enhanced torque loads - without increasing fluid pressures against the pistons and seals for energizing the clutch packs. which seems like a better idea - increased pressure against the seals causing them to blow out, or not increasing the pressures and getting much the similar effect. Type F trans fluid has shown little to no adverse effect in the life of a dextron-3 transmission. I know this, I've rebuild MANY transmissions, I'm gathering by what you've typed you've probably rebuilt a couple, but what would qualify you as an expert against using type F transmission fluid? Sure you've probably read a few things, but what makes you the expert in this situation? --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Posted July 15, 2005 Report Share Posted July 15, 2005 What makes me an expert? Nothing. Hell, I'm not even ASE certified yet.....I've only been out of school for a couple of months now.....but I did pay attention in transmission class (managed an A for what its worth) and currently work with one of the better GM transmission guys in the state at the dealership. I have installed two shift kits......one in a 700R4 and one in a 4L60-E. One kit was from TransGo, the other B&M. They both included a seal kit, new clutches, plates, 2-4 band, and shafts to replace the springs in the accumulators and 2-4 actuator. I believe there was also a new spacer plate and gaskets for the valve body. We never split the pump or touched anything that dealt with pressure control. Also opted for a harder reaction shell and sun gear. I'm sure you know how much they like to strip out. Line pressures weren't actually increased......we did measure this before and after. Its firmer shifts were achieved by the fact that everything applied right away as you didn't have to wait for something to fill up and then apply. Also has a tougher set of clutches and band to not slip under the harsher apply and higher power levels. The seals in the transmission appeared to be the same, only new. Dexron III is the ATF GM Hydramatic Engineers require for a reason.....I'm guessing its to keep Grandma happy with nice smooth shifts that are barely noticeable. I don't know their reasoning......I don't work for GM Powertrain. I just fix their busted shit. I don't like the idea of putting what isn’t supposed to be inside of a transmission, in a transmission. I have seen additives and other crap used gum up stuff, causing a much worse failure than simply fixing it the first time. Type F lacks friction modifiers, so stuff doesn't slip as easily, as you have said. My problem with Type F is that nothing is getting applied any sooner....pressures are the same and the oil passageways are the same. All you are doing is allowing a band or set of clutches to not slip. But, if everything is working properly, there shouldn't be any slip under a WOT shift. If you want a race transmission, go get a race transmission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted July 15, 2005 Report Share Posted July 15, 2005 Wow Canada.. I would have to say you do qualify - went to school (I got an A also in automatic transmissions and transaxel's - and an A in manual transmissions/transaxels) - sorry if I sounded bitchy long day at work and such. Personal expirence - I've used type F in MANY different GM transmissions, th350's (which you could rebuild in a sandstorm and have no problems) 700R4's, 4L80-E's, 4L60-E's, 125 C's, 440T4's, and now my 4T60-E, and haven't had any problems with any of the transmissions going out, in my First Z-34 I didn't touch the transmission at all, I went through 6 of them (Automatics) (turned out to be the thrust bearing in the engine digging the torque converter into the trans too deep and dumping metal shavings all over the place) that trans only saw what the dealership 's put in it (it was under warranty) I put B&M Trick Shift trans fluid in ONE 700R4 and it blew up nearly right away (all the lip seals went out - quickly) due to the fact there's almost no anti-foaming agents in that smurf blood. I'm currently, and will continue to be a firm believer in type F fluid - if you want to make the most out of it, block the accumulator, and get a custom chip that allows for no crossover time durring the shifts at WOT. Oh, by the way, at WOT, a trans SHOULD have next to no slippage, this is why type F helps a lot, because it will reduce the slippage at that point. anyone wanna try type A trans fluid? LOL --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Posted July 16, 2005 Report Share Posted July 16, 2005 I think I would rather try +3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoroCorona Posted July 17, 2005 Report Share Posted July 17, 2005 ATf+3 would prolly be a good alternative to Dexron. Just as much antifoaming agents and a slightly higher friction co-efficiant. Sounds like a win win situation to me. Or 10w-40 and some sand... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THe_DeTAiL3R Posted July 17, 2005 Report Share Posted July 17, 2005 Or 10w-40 and some sand... I think that's what the previous owner put in mine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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