Vegeta Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 Ok, so ive been tuning this car for a couple weeks now, only to learn the MAF screen is off. No wonder it was way off. Put a screened maf on it and the stock chip was much better off. So anyway, I need to know if people want me to spend time tuning with the screen? Its easy to pop off and my chip will make it work better than stock with the screen. So yeah, what do you guys think? Should I continue with the screen off and just sell the chips with that mod as a requirement? A lot of performance guys do this anyway so I figure its feasible. Once I know the chip works well in another car without the screen, Ill know the fate of this tuning, but assuming it does turn out, what do you guys think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted April 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Thats awesome, no one even cares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prospeeder Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 lol, well, can u really get much power out of a chip on an N/A engine? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Thats awesome, no one even cares. That's what you get from W-body. THe only threads even remotely related to performance are 10 page discussion on cold air intakes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5speedz34 Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Thats awesome, no one even cares. That's what you get from W-body. THe only threads even remotely related to performance are 10 page discussion on cold air intakes... So true! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted April 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Ive been able to get solid gains out of every other chip, despite what some people say, the stock setup is not optimal for even a stock motor. So far, this car has more power but I couldn't tell you how much better than the stock chip it is just yet. I fixed the fuel tables and modified the spark table already for normal driving and idle so that alone will help consistancy and power. I also changed the power enrichment and accelerator enrichment so I know its substantial on the computer changes. Im just waiting on the shift points so I can test them out and also setup the 2nd gear start switch to be a performance shift option (which anyone with this setup can add to their car). This also means ill be improving the 91-93 chips with the shift points once I have them figured out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Will you be able to update your old 91-93 FFP chips with the new shift points? Will it be possible to add a 2nd gear start switch to a car not equipped with it from the factory, and have the performance shift option? Oh and BTW, what grade of fuel do you recommend using with my chip? Currently I've been using mid grade (89-91 octane) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBULS Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Im just waiting on the shift points so I can test them out and also setup the 2nd gear start switch to be a performance shift option (which anyone with this setup can add to their car). This also means ill be improving the 91-93 chips with the shift points once I have them figured out. Now THIS is where a really nice improvement can be made. You guys (Prospeeder for instance) need to be a little more caring about this. Vegeta is actually going out of his way to make a damn good chip for your cars that both makes power AND improves powertrain management (which sucks ass in stock form). He's also not resting on his laurels and is actually improving his original chip (which made quite impressive power gains) with the same powertrain stuff. Also............MY sugestion is to tune the chip with the screen IN place. Taking the screen off offers no proven gains by itself, and if it makes tuning harder......... Finally. What shiftpoints are you currently looking at? I'm sure you remember our multipage thread about this If you CAN in fact get the 2nd gear start switch setup as a performance shift, you could then set the shiftpoints in "D" (non performance) to the tranny's limit (6500 1-2, 6250 2-3 and 6K 3-4), and then go for OPTIMAL shifts (performance-wise............NOT longevity-wise ) with the switch activated. I forsee some VERY nice gains to be had once testing is all done with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBULS Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 BTW. Do the 94-95 SFI cars use the same shift tables as 91-93 cars? I KNOW that 96+ OBDII cars use a different setup with more agressive (higher rpm) WOT shifts (for instance, 2-3 is triggered at something like 86mph IIRC vs 80mph for the older cars), but I haven't heard anything specific about the "OBD 1.5's". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted April 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 I dont even have access to the shift points yet, as im waiting on getting the full code (cross fingers). I am sure its not quite the same, though based on LV8 which is pseudo MAP readings. Thats how I compared the spark tables and went from there. I do remember that page and will be looking at it once I am able to do shift points. You can add the 2nd gear start to any 4T60-E car, though I can only deal with 93 3.1 and 91-95 DOHC since they are OBD1. I am using midgrade for tuning, same with all the chips. You can run regular if you want but mid grade will probably run a little better since thats what I tuned for. I know regular won't blow your motor or anything as I switch sometimes depending on how much cash I have. I am all done tuning without the screen, and GPXSS tested it out. Said it ran just fine and might have had more power. He noticed the 1 shift point seemed to be a little higher but I obviously didnt touch it. I thought it shifted a tad higher as well on the cutlass so who knows what the deal is. I know someone else with the 91-93 chip that I can do the shift points on was having a problem with it actually shifting when I was telling it to. Either worn trans or vacuum from power changed something? I dunno, I didn't have the car to try things out on. I will be tuning this car with the screen though once it arrives. It really shouldn't take too long since the stock fuel tables are decently close. Still, i have plenty of other variables to toy with like I did without the screen. Im certainly not resting on these old chips. Ive learned a great deal in the 5 years ive been doing this so I plan to make improvements on all the chips as I get access to the vehicles again to try things out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteOut Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 Thats awesome, no one even cares. Whoa there I care, I just haven't logged on in the last two days. Personally I'd appreciate it if you left the screen on. From what I understand it contributes to straightening air flow, thus promoting laminar flow of the air and increasing intake air velocity (who knows if it works or not). At any rate I'll definitely be interested in one of the chips as soon as you get them done. Hell I'll even test it out for you on my car (wink wink). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z34_nut Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 I'm partly interested in this. Besides the shift points, do you think you can improve on michaels old car? Of course, it would have to be EPA friendly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 You can add the 2nd gear start to any 4T60-E car, though I can only deal with 93 3.1 and 91-95 DOHC since they are OBD1. Would you happen to know what pins/wires I would have to wire the 2nd gear start switch into? Im certainly not resting on these old chips. Ive learned a great deal in the 5 years ive been doing this so I plan to make improvements on all the chips as I get access to the vehicles again to try things out. When the 91-93 chip shift points are updated, will it be possible just to send the chip to you? Ontario is pretty far away from Colorado, and I cant afford to not have my car for more than a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted April 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 I live in indiana, and yeah, just send the chip back for the update. Its not done now but its something I can do with a car once I am able to test it out. Michael's car was tuned by himself already. I have no idea how far off any of it is or what I can possibly do. Id have to see the car to know. I don't know if I would say the screen increases intake velocity. It doesn't straighten the air so the MAF can be read accurately so I am definetly looking to tune it with the screen in place to compare gas milage and performance. The 2nd gear start is just 1 wire that needs to be grounded in order for it to be activated. I don't know what pin it is off the top of my head, but I can ask someone that knows next time I see him online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 Hmm... when Tony makes his way over there to have Aaron's car tuned, I might just make the trip out there myself to have mine tuned as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 The 2nd gear start is just 1 wire that needs to be grounded in order for it to be activated. I don't know what pin it is off the top of my head, but I can ask someone that knows next time I see him online. Ok Thanks. I would really appreciate that. Maybe you could PM me when you find out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prospeeder Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 what is so great about second gear start? is it bad for ur tranny? why dont they use it anymore? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 what is so great about second gear start? is it bad for ur tranny? why dont they use it anymore? Mainly its good for icy/poor road conditions to get better traction. It *possibly* could be bad if you are starting out in 2nd gear all the time, but the occasional start isn't bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBULS Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 I do remember that page and will be looking at it once I am able to do shift points. Just some FYI if you have a hard time finding that thread again, it's the "3.4 5 speed video" thread, and the shiftpoint discussion gets started on page 2. Just to help you search Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted April 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 Thanks, that will make it real easy to go ahead and bookmark. 2nd gear start grew up wanting to be the performance shift button:P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 I think they also dropped it because of the 'lack of power' complaints.......people just don't know enough about their own cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5speedz34 Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 What exactly does the performance shift do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 Tony you have a 5-speed... It raies the shift points and I think makes them shift faster and harder. At leastthat is what it does in the GTPs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sl3196 Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 It raies the shift points and I think makes them shift faster and harder. At leastthat is what it does in the GTPs Only raises the shift points with an aftermarket pcm. Stock it doesn't change the shift points. What it does is shift down with less throttle when in p.s. mode. So more responsive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 sl3196 is right (as he owns one)......it does NOT change WOT shifts....only downshifts sooner.....which is about as worthwhile as the tits on BIGBULS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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