95monte866 Posted February 22, 2005 Report Share Posted February 22, 2005 Hi All, I'm new to this forum and I'm looking for some help. I just recently bought this 95 monte and cant figure out this low brake pedal situation. I recently have: 1. Replaced master cylinder 2. Replaced both rear(leaking) cylinders 3. Replaced both drums 4. Replaced shoes 5. Replaced Front pads 6. Adjusted rear adjusters 7. Pressure bleed the whole system (10 times) 8. I inspected everything There's no leaks , no air in the system, and no bulging brake lines. I looked at the abs modulator and tested the " homing of the motor pack" and it works as it should. The car stops but has alot of pedal travel before the brakes starts to grab. I've been working on cars for over 20 years and never ran into one like this. Could a faulty abs modulator valve cause this? or does this type of system typically have alot of pedal travel 4-6" (1"-2" from the floor) Any input would great. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Posted February 22, 2005 Report Share Posted February 22, 2005 have you checked the tube comming off the brake booster? It can become soft. Mine has all new brakes all the way around and still has a soft low pedal, as most of our cars do. I would buy they stainless steel brake lines and see if that helps. Later Jay Keep us updated on what happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95monte866 Posted February 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2005 the vacuum assist seems to work ok thanks for responding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteMonteZZZ Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 95monte, my car has a soft brake pedal, compared to other cars. Everything is new on my vehicle. If you have an early 95, you get the small front disc rotors and rear drums. So those don't help braking any. As long as the booster hose is fine (not collapsing) then you're ok, well, you SHOULD be. My brake guy said he can manually adjust pedal travel, but I really don't mind. I got accustomed to the braking in my car. Also, if you havenj't already, swing by MyMonte.com! WMZZZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 I have had a bad abs block cause a low pedal on a '96 Taurus, so it is possible. I never had a low pedal on any of my w-cars, so I'd say it's not normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1990lumina Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 Maybe I'll check this line as my brake pedal falls to the floor (no braking action till about 2" off the floor). I can't even get it to lock the wheels anymore, it really lacking braking. Hell, if I kill the engine I can stop the car faster without the assist then with! I'd been told by many that this is normal, I feel it is not, and not to safe either! - Jeff L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93CutlassSupreme Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 Maybe I'll check this line as my brake pedal falls to the floor (no braking action till about 2" off the floor). I can't even get it to lock the wheels anymore, it really lacking braking. Hell, if I kill the engine I can stop the car faster without the assist then with!I'd been told by many that this is normal, I feel it is not, and not to safe either! - Jeff L. my Cutlass would never engage the abs on dry pavement....i just accepted it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 my Cutlass would never engage the abs on dry pavement....i just accepted it i don't think i ever could get my wheels to lockup on dry pavement if i tried, let alone make the abs work. i supose i have a fairly low brake pedal in both my luminas, as far as i can figgure its normal op. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95monte866 Posted February 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 I came across this tech bulletin.http://www.carquest.com/techbulletins/brakes/2001/CQB%2001-03.pdf The only thing I havent tried yet was to watch the gears for movement. Its gonna be a pain to get that cover off without removing the whole assembly all over again. Well I guess I'll give it a shot, whats a few more hours of work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron350 Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 95Monte866 Did you use a new Delco master cylinder? How did you pressure bleed the brakes? I remember a 95GP that the mechanic could not get any pedel on. They finally had to hook up a pressure ball on the master cyl. and a vacuum bleeder on the bleeder valves to remove all the air. Your ABS is extremely hard to remove all the air from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HokemBokem Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 Man you guys musta been slammin those brakes on dry pavemetn to try and get that abs to engage Ive never had to slam the pedal so hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95monte866 Posted February 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 I put on a rebuilt unit from Pep Boys. I know sometimes rebuilt ones are junk. I used a pressure bleeder at the master cylinder and bleed the modulator then the rears and then the fronts. I ran about a quart and a half through each one. I didnt use a vacuum bleeder along with the pressure bleeder, but I was thinking the same thing. There may be air still in the modulator. Ill try a vacuum bleeder and pressure bleed and see if that works. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93CutlassSupreme Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 my Cutlass would never engage the abs on dry pavement....i just accepted it i don't think i ever could get my wheels to lockup on dry pavement if i tried, let alone make the abs work. i supose i have a fairly low brake pedal in both my luminas, as far as i can figgure its normal op. your Z34 stopped MUCH better than my CS EVER did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1990lumina Posted February 24, 2005 Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 My Lumina doesn't have ABS, which is why I was a little worried. When I first got it (in fall of 04) the brakes had just been done by GM when my grandma had it. During this winter I noticed that these brakes feel like shit. I'll admit I haven't been driving this car like an old lady either, but still I feel they should last longer (if wearing out, no sqreeching yet!) Anyone do this...get into your parents car, or friends whatever..anything that isn't a W and when you come up to a red light or stop sign you damn near put your head through the windshield since you are so used to pushing the brake pedal down hard? I've done this countless times, which is why I think my car isn't normal and all the other ones are - Jeff L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutlsp Posted February 24, 2005 Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 lol i don't have to push my brake pedal down hard on my 88 cutlass that runs i feel lucky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1138 Posted February 24, 2005 Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 Anyone do this...get into your parents car, or friends whatever..anything that isn't a W and when you come up to a red light or stop sign you damn near put your head through the windshield since you are so used to pushing the brake pedal down hard?I've done this countless times, which is why I think my car isn't normal and all the other ones are - Jeff L. When I had both my Lumina and this GP, I'd get out of the Lumina and drive the GP and almost hit my head on the wheel because I'd stomp on the Prix's brake pedal. '88-'93 W-Body brakes suck ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1990lumina Posted February 24, 2005 Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 ^^^Yeah, after I made that post I realized I shouldn't have said "any" W-body, just the pre-93 and 94 ofr Lumina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted February 24, 2005 Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 If it means anything, my '95 feels about the same as my sister's '93. But under hard braking, the '93 DOES take more effort, just a little though. But all her brakes are brand new, including rears, and the calipers are fairly new back there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95monte866 Posted February 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2005 I havent done anything with the repair yet, but I did a few road tests. I tried out the ABS on snow and it works as it should. I tried out a hard stop on dry payment, and it stops on a dime, and abs kicked in, cause I skidded a bit. The brakes work as they should, but the pedal travel is alot lower than it should be. Is there a adjustment for this? Or is this a Delco thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3pt1lumina Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 In my 90 Lumina, the only time the brakes felt good was when I got it and a professional had done them. Ever since I attempted doing brakes on it, pedal is ridiculously low... and I mean low. I became used to it til I drove my dad's 97 Lumina or my mom's 03 Impala. Then I put just about anyone with me through the front of the car. Early W-body brakes suck. Not gonna lie that is a downfall on these cars which all of us W-body owners know and appreciate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95monte866 Posted March 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2005 Well besides every @$%5*& idiot light coming, including the abs and the speedo sticking, that I have to tap on, the thing still runs. I think the problem with the low pedal is the modulator. The abs light wasnt on until today and wont go off. I did notice I dont hear that familar abs crunch or parking noise as loud as it did when the light stayed off. I talked to my Dad, the original owner of the car, and he said the breaks felt normal when they bought the car. He's very picky when it comes to brakes. He restores cars and wouldnt have tolerated this type of poor engineering. I havent done anything with the brakes yet, Michigans weather been tough. When I do I will repost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regal_GS_1989 Posted March 9, 2005 Report Share Posted March 9, 2005 Shit, I've Managed to lock up al four wheels on my 88 before on dry Pavement. I haven't tried to do that on My GS, but I think that my 88 Has WAY better Brakes than the GS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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