spooling Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 Folks: New to the W-Body thing, but not new to GM products. I have picked-up a real nice '92 Lumina with 30K miles on it. I have performed all of the maintenance that one with a GM could perform, fluids, trans service, clean TB, plugs (AC Delco) and assortment of other things (fuel filter) bla-bla-bla. When I test drove the car, it ran wonderful. I parked it for ~ 4 days outside, (it rained) car had been garaged previously. I then started it to fill it with gas, and bring to my house to do PM to it, and it was running horrible, no power, and sounding like a rattle down near the catalytic converted region. Got it to my house, and it cleared-up. I pluged in my scanner, and read no codes, O2 was fluctuation correctly, indicating good sensor. I thought maybe H2O in the fuel, and added 2 cans of dry-gas, and some STP FI cleaner. After 1 week of laboring on this machine, I started it to move it back to my mom's house as I got it for her to drive, and same deal. Running horribly, almost like the ECM is in "batch mode". Felt like the TCC was locked, but that was not the case, as I touched the brake, and I could feel the TCC solenoid dis-engage. I am kinda stumped, and would consider the following, since if spit no codes. 1. Maybe H2O in the ECM? 2. My buddy with a GP indicated possible corrosion on some electrical terminals in the engine compartment? If so, whitch ones, and where? 3. Bad gas, or H2O in teh gas? 4. EGR? 5. Plugged catalytic converter? Your assistance is valued here. TIA. Edward spooling@stage1.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1138 Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 2. My buddy with a GP indicated possible corrosion on some electrical terminals in the engine compartment? If so, whitch ones, and where? The remote positive terminal, located on the driver side strut tower. Make sure that nut is tight, and not corroded. If it looks remotely dirty, clean it with a wire brush (WITH THE TERMINAL DISCONNECTED FROM THE BATTERY!!) and tighten it down good. It also could be bad gas. How long was it sitting? Check vacuum and spark also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 be sure its getting fuel and spark. did you change the fuel filter it may need changed since the car sat so long. prety much the order of ignition related things goes as such: Spark Plugs Spark Plug Wires Coils Ignition Control Module Crank Sensor thats about the order of things what you want to follow when troubleshooting the ignition be sure that your getting proper fuel pressure. get a fuel pressure gauge if you must, around 41psi is normal as i recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intlcutlass Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 You mentioned that it rained, and you put ges in it... Maybe the coils got wet, or maybe you got a bad tank of gas? Either way, I wouldn't start replacing anything yet. Next fill up put some 94 octane in it, and make sure everything is dry.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maybe2fast Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 money on the cat... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intlcutlass Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 money on the cat... Are the manifolds glowing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89GPSE Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 Make sure that the Coil Packs are dry and grounded good. I would start here it is cheap (free) and common to go bad because of where thay are placed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooling Posted January 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2005 Hey Guys: Thanks for your feedback. Anyways, the car is at my mom's and I have not had time to get back with it. It was missing before I put gas in it, thus eliminating the bad gas thing. 89GPSE - Concerning the Coil Packs, it is possible that they got wet. To check for a good ground, simply use an ohm meter to the block or is there another technique? I know on the Buick coil packs, for the 3.8L turbo cars, that the resistance across the towers is ~ 11K ohms, is this the same to check the coild with the W-Body cars? Also, to check the ignition module - what is the procedure? maybe2fast - Based on past experience, I would also place $ on that bet. I am wondering if the procedure for R&R'ing the cat is a bolt-on one, as there is no emissions any-longer here and I could just "force feed" the cat, and put it back on? Thanks again guys..... Regards. Edward spooling@stage1.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihela816 Posted January 27, 2005 Report Share Posted January 27, 2005 The buick turbos got the magnavox style coils. The resistances are probably different but the procedure to check them is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooling Posted February 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Got to fixing this yesterday. I grounded each cylinder and found the issue was with the 1st pair of coil packs, so I changed that pack, and same deal. I got a new module and all new coil packs and the problem is history. On teh Buick Turbos, I have a "simulator" that allows us to check each module while it is mounted to teh coil pack, but obviously, it will not work with this design. I think the grounding of each cylinder with a test light through the plug end that attaches to teh coil pack was a great test technique. My corvette buddy tought me that one. Anyways guys, thanks for all of your feedback. The 3100 sure has some "pep" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryk2003 Posted February 5, 2005 Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Got to fixing this yesterday. I grounded each cylinder and found the issue was with the 1st pair of coil packs, so I changed that pack, and same deal. I got a new module and all new coil packs and the problem is history. On teh Buick Turbos, I have a "simulator" that allows us to check each module while it is mounted to teh coil pack, but obviously, it will not work with this design. I think the grounding of each cylinder with a test light through the plug end that attaches to teh coil pack was a great test technique. My corvette buddy tought me that one. Anyways guys, thanks for all of your feedback. The 3100 sure has some "pep" glad to hear you fixed it...i have a MISS feeling that i can't figure out...its intermittent...i'm just curious of this test procedure you are talking about!?...i don't quite understand?...did you hook a test light to the coil plug, then the end of the testlight to ground?...then watch for it to light?... :? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooling Posted February 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Hey Terry: The test light is a nice tool, as you can use it to "stab" each cylinder through the plug wire connected to the coil tower. Ground the other end, and listen for that cylinder to "miss" and not fire that is being grounded. If the engine condition remains un-changed during grounding of that cylinder, then, it is that cylinder that is creating your problem. Good Luck..... Edward spooling@stage1.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Dubya Posted February 5, 2005 Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 When I tested my coils we looked for anything between 5 and 10 ohms of resistance. I've done those many, many times now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooling Posted February 6, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Hey Ryan: I think you mean 5 to 10K ohms? These measured out in the neighborhood of 5.7K ohms after warmed. The module was most definately the problem, as I swapped the "suspected" coil pack with another, and same deal. Regards..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryk2003 Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 well, what i did was bought a good coil pack and i started testing it...when i put it in the middle, the car seemed to run great @ first...but, about a week later, it went back to the same old shit...so, i'm kinda wondering if its the module...tomarrow i think i'll try to do what you mentioned, and/or put the old coil back on... :? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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