futuretgper Posted September 12, 2004 Report Share Posted September 12, 2004 hey guys as you may or may not know i just got a 1990 tgp low miles and already problems...i have some problems with start up and WOT and im looking for a a good analyist so here come the questions! Map sensor read 13-21 psi could it be wrong/software error(wastegate issues? what is the typical airflow(in g/sec.)? when should it go into closed loop, based on what sensors? should it go into open loop on Power Enrichment Mode? what might cuase super low o2 reading that dramatically drop to about 24mv? when cuts occured at shift and wot the o2 actually read 4mv for like 4 or 5 seconds also the car looks like it runs open loop but the software says closed loop...long term count reverts to 128 and the air fuel ratio richens like it should but its not in open loop again im logging with DataMaster Beta softeware and i have a 3mb file logged if anyone is willing to look at it PM me or email me and ill get back back to u on how u would like it sent... o.k. symptoms: 1. car idles roughly after warming up a little 2. car exhibits fuel cut just before shift points @ WOT 3. car actually stalls and will not start after moderate agressive driving or above. we thought fuel pump at first and we got rid of that notion when we tested pressure in the line and held close to 35psi...also responsive to throttle. 4. no codes were shown at any time durring the logged time. ok i think thats it...again anybody who wants to check out my numbers gimme a pm or email or better yet aim (shloppymcgee) thanks alot, mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2004 ps car does start if you leave it for like a couple hours...but its kinda speratic and floods the rest of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Dubya Posted September 12, 2004 Report Share Posted September 12, 2004 Have you done a compression test? How long did it sit? Could be a hung up valve or something along those lines.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 no i haven't checked compression but i dont think thats the problem...once the car starts it runs pretty well but the idle is rough and like i wrote before it wants to cut out under WOT conitions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted September 13, 2004 Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 I'd be willing to bet it's a bad fuel injector and it's cutting one of the quad drivers to prevent computer burnout. I'd ohm check all the injectors with the engine as warm as you can handle it - (it gets real hot) I had a beretta that was doing exactly what you're talkin' about - and that was my problem. I ended up replacing the fuel pump too because that's what killed my injector, and I ended up replacing the fuel pressure regulator because that's what killed my fuel pump, and it killed my O2 sensor because it kept running lean and way too hot in the exhaust manifold. just a few things to check for now. a bad 02 will screw things up real bad. --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted September 13, 2004 Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 I'd check the injectors as well. I'm just glad to see someone is using Datamaster as well, I'm having a hard time connecting to the ECM. When you have the cable hooked up does your DIC update and display fuel? Mine shows 0 MPG no matter what, and as SOON as I unplug the cable, viola, everything works fine. But when the cable's plugged in I get no data. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 14, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2004 dic? driver information center? i guess i haven't paid any attention to it ill check next time i hook up... have you had any strange numbers appear (software issues) or am i really having a probllem with sensors or true mechanical issues, becuase im reading 144.2 Kpa (kilopascals) off the Manafold absolute pressure. this converts to about 21psi!!! so i have issues if its not the program...my flow numbers seam to great like 1200 cm^3/s or something crazy are these numbers way off? and i haven't seen any codes yet... is there another simple way to get the codes with out a computer...like a flashing check engine procedure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Dubya Posted September 14, 2004 Report Share Posted September 14, 2004 Yes, you can get codes by jumping the diagnostic connector located under the dash on the drivers side. Simply get a paperclip and bend it in a U shape, and then with the key in the on position with the car not running, stick the paperclip in the top 2 right connectors of the diagnostic connector. It will flash a 12, which will be one blink, then a pause, then 2 blinks, (maybe 3, which would make it 13, I can't remember) and that signifies the ECM is working correctly. After it flashes that 12 or 13 3 times, it will then spit out and error codes that are stored in the system. It will blink then pause then blink, and cylce that code three times, then continue until it is done, then flashing the 12 or 13 again. Check that and someone here can tell you the code diagnosis with their manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfewtrail Posted September 15, 2004 Report Share Posted September 15, 2004 dic? driver information center? i guess i haven't paid any attention to it ill check next time i hook up... have you had any strange numbers appear (software issues) or am i really having a probllem with sensors or true mechanical issues' date=' becuase im reading 144.2 Kpa (kilopascals) off the Manafold absolute pressure. this converts to about 21psi!!! so i have issues if its not the program...my flow numbers seam to great like 1200 cm^3/s or something crazy are these numbers way off? and i haven't seen any codes yet... is there another simple way to get the codes with out a computer...like a flashing check engine procedure?[/quote'] I believe you need to go ahead and subtract 14.7psi from that 20.91psi to account for atmospheric pressure. That would mean you're seeing a bit over 6psi of actual boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 17, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 yeah about subtracting 14.7, ive heard that before, but according to that i would be showing vaccum most of the time is that normal?...and 1bar=14.7psi=101.4 kilopascals and i was reading way over that (145 kilopascals) wich doesn't seem right to me. you would think it could only read up to the top of 1bar so does it add on the first bar (14.7psi) already, then just sitting there with the engine off it should sit at 101.4kilopascals and go up from there , according to what you saying... thats the only way subtracting would work...i havent checked that yet ill look at the readings before i started to see if thats right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted September 17, 2004 Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 Yes, the 2 bar map reads -14.7-0 (first bar) 0- +14.7 psi (second bar) Yes you would be in vacuum most of the time, when the car is under boost (ie, more than 0) you are NOT in vacuum. And w/ then engine off, you would indeed be at 0 (or 1 bar, IOW, 1 atmoshphere) So everything looks okay from that standpoint. As long as it's a stock chip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 21, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 ok so we had bought a new o2 sensor, and it didn't do anything, so today we tried to run the car with the o2 disconected and it the car runs fine...when we reconnect it the car loads up and runs really rich! anybody please help! and someone please ask to read my datamaster logs...please.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted September 21, 2004 Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 Well, send it on over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skalor Posted September 21, 2004 Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 Do you still have the stock x-over?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 21, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 yes, it is still the original x-over god910...will do...ill pm ya in a bit here figure somethign out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 Damn, B, you gotta actually log onto AIM to send me the file. Just email it to me. god910(at)gmail.com I'm kind of curious now, because I got all my shit up and running, and got some logs. (Even got a log of me beating a 4th gen T/A, it was a good race) I want to compare what I got w/ some other logs from other people. I've been diagnosing a cold off idle problem, and I think I have a vacuum leak, but don't know what most people are seeing at idle cold, soo..... I DO know that my TPS has a flat spot in it. Never noticed it before. Huh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2004 so ive finally given up on fixing the problem myself and i am bringing the the car to a shop that jeff m suggested, thanx jeff!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted September 30, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 well we didn't want to pull the upper plenum if we didn't have to so we had a local garage do a diagnostic on it...turns out there were two bad injectors....so last night my dad and i pulled everything apart and replaced all of them (600$ worth, what a joke) and now it seems to run much more smoothly. (but im not sure its 100% fixed, time will tell) it kind of hesitates thought if u just give it a little throttle off the linie, but it seems to be getting better. i noticed one thing, a little more power now. break the fronts loose no problem off the line. it was only 55 or 60 degrees last night though so that could make the diff. p.s we aready replaced them ourselves, but does 1200 bucks for parts and labor sound high for injector replacement at a garage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Dubya Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Yeah I did mine once and it took me a little more than an hour and a half. That was not knowing what I was doing. They were easy, not worth 10 hrs labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
god910 Posted October 2, 2004 Report Share Posted October 2, 2004 I bought a j/y V from MO, had it shipped for $350, I used the injectors off it, for my auto car. Guess what, they work, and I wouldn't spend $1200 on a whole car (cept the 2 I have) Let alone some damn injectors. I'm switching all my injectors to Accel Injectors after I fix the rail fitment situation. I spent $250 for the set of 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futuretgper Posted October 14, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2004 so the dealership gave us the wrong injectors...we insisted they checked to make sure they were for the 3.1 turbo, they said they were posative. we put them on and had all those problems...now we have the right ones on after going back to the dealership and bitching. they gave us the right injectors for the price of the regular 3.1's and threw in new intake gaskets free...now the car runs really nice. hopefully for a long time oh yeah and i picked up a crossover from Jeff M. but thanks for the help guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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